Senior Ladies FS

[mirai4life]

LP Videos - Japanese Commentators and no commercial cut

Gracie Gold - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yGKOVvJam-M
Polina Edmunds - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVyJnNcaxcw
Mirai Nagasu - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBEh4__i1xk
Ashley Wagner - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqFo_TS8s3k

More https://www.youtube.com/user/okoko01/videos

 

[Ziggy]

And this is why there should be clear and transparent rules regarding nominating the team for ISU Championships. It would be completely unfair to suddenly change the way you pick the team because the 'wrong' skater failed to meet the criteria.

Now, I realise that USFS can't officially state that Nationals' results are used to determine Olympic spots but that is their problem and they should have found a way around that.

In case of Denney/Coughlin, the result was extremely close (but I would argue they were overmarked). In case of Wagner, she lost by eight points to the third placed skater. EIGHT. It wasn't even close.

Do I think that Wagner is more deserving of Olympics than Nagasu? Yes, I do. Because she has had better results so far this season (and last season). Which is why USFS should have designed some kind of formula for rewarding more than one competition performance. But since they didn't and since they have always gone on Nationals in the past, Nagasu should be going to the Olympics and not Wagner.

I think Polina should be sent to Worlds instead. She is nothing but jumps, I don't know how her PCS was so high. I think the Olympic team should be Gold, Wagner, and Nagasu.

Please. Nagasu has poorly choreographed programs and her basics aren't great. It's not like she has this big advantage over Edmunds in the PCS department. And when you compare Edmunds' and Nagasu's competitive record this season, Edmunds' scores were higher.

 

[Frenchie]

I can't believe I fell asleep before the NBC coverage began! I feel like such a failure :
Anyway, good morning from the other side of the pond!
I just got to see most of the performances via youtube. Wow, that was intense.
Heartbreaking at times.
As with the Ice Dancers, I'd wish the US could send 4 girls - be it for different reasons.

Do I think that Wagner is more deserving of Olympics than Nagasu? Yes, I do. Because she has had better results so far this season (and last season). Which is why USFS should have designed some kind of formula for rewarding more than one competition performance. But since they didn't and since they have always gone on Nationals in the past, Nagasu should be going to the Olympics and not Wagner.

Your entire post reflects my thoughts 100%, and it's formulated better than I ever could. So I'll just paste it here and say "me too!".

So: me too!

 

[Frenchie]

The case more on point was in 1992 when Paul Wylie was picked over Mark Mitchell for the Olympic team. Mark finished higher at the National Championships, but Paul went on to win the silver in Albertville.

To be exact, Wylie did finish higher than Mitchell at Nationals.
It still was a huge controversy because
- the judges massively held up Wylie in 4th after a disastrous SP
- Mitchell got 2nd in the SP where many felt he should have gotten 1st (unlike today, his 3A2T was deemed worth way more than Bowman's 3Lz3T in 1st)
- Wylie placed 2nd in the FS ahead of Mitchell despite being way inferior technically - by a 5-4 vote!
All 3 things had to happen for Wylie to beat Mitchell (2.0+2.0 vs 1.0+3.0; better FS wins)
So he made it by the skin of his teeth because of 3 controversial decisions in a row.

I actually think that they had a PRIME time to manipulate things and show favoritism.
Mirai skated after everyone but Gracie. They knew what she needed to to make the podium and where on the podium she could land.
They easily could have scored her low enough that Ashley could be in 3rd. They didn't.

To lower Mirai's scores enough to let Ashley overtake her, they'd have had to give her way lower PCS than she got during the GP season when the National Inflation for everybody else at these US Nationals has reached unprecedented heights. 8 points was too much to manipulate, so thankfully they didn't even try. That would have been a big disgrace.

BTW: My heart breaks again for Christina Gao. After such a terrific start with 3F3T and pristine clean jumps, she fell apart in the end. So sad for her.

 

[Sacto95834]

To be exact, Wylie did finish higher than Mitchell at Nationals.
It still was a huge controversy because
- the judges massively held up Wylie in 4th after a disastrous SP
- Mitchell got 2nd in the SP where many felt he should have gotten 1st (unlike today, his 3A2T was deemed worth way more than Bowman's 3Lz3T in 1st)
- Wylie placed 2nd in the FS ahead of Mitchell despite being way inferior technically.
All 3 things had to happen for Wylie to beat Mitchell (2.0+2.0 vs 1.0+3.0; better FS wins)
So he made it by the skin of his teeth because of 3 controversial decisions in a row.
:

My memory is getting foggier as the years go by. Yes you are correct, I liked both Mark and Paul, so I was bitter when Mark lost to Paul and then was bumped from the team. It was because of Todd. He had an injury and so somebody had to be bumped. This was the good old days when we had a deep bench.

 

[leafygreens]

I am an Ashley fan and the outcome broke my heart, but I think Ashley should be left off the team. This was nationals, the closest simulation of pressure like the Olympics, and she faltered both SP & LP. In LP she went before most contenders and should have felt less pressure but crumbled. The three skaters after her all amazingly rose to the challenge. There have hardly been any cases where USFS didn't use nationals finishes as the selection criteria other than cases of injury like Michelle and Nancy. Everyone skates knowing that those spots are on the line at nationals. If you can't deal with the pressure then you shouldn't be named to the team. Ashley also faltered in 2013 nationals but lucked out because Gracie had a poor SP. Ashley does not have a history of perfection and this was not a one-off bad night.

Re: Polina, may I remind everyone that Sasha's first senior international event was 2002 Olympics, where she placed 4th. She was the national silver medalist, like Polina. No reason to leave Polina off the team.

 

[sillylionlove]

I haven't been commenting lately but this is what I think. No matter who they send to Sochi, I don't think and American women will medal. For worlds they should concentrate on keeping three spots and building up the women's competitors for the next Olympic cycle. Still I'm interested to see who they send.

 

[seabm7]

Re: Polina, may I remind everyone that Sasha's first senior international event was 2002 Olympics, where she placed 4th. She was the national silver medalist, like Polina. No reason to leave Polina off the team.

Sasha did GP series during the previous season.

 

[samson]

Hmmmm I wonder why the USFSA is planning on announcing the teams at noon tomorrow instead of after the mens event. The US can have two subs for the team event right? While certainly not ideal it would be a way to get all four women at the Olympics.

Again... far from ideal but still an option.

They could also have Denney and Coughlin sub for Castelli and Shnapir in the long program of the team event.

UGH it's all so difficult to process! What will become of the US Olympic team?!?!

Mirai was so wonderful tonight. It was such a joy to see her skate that way and be received by a crowd like that. And her reaction in the kiss and cry was the sweetest. It's like you could see all the weight lifting off her. It's clearly been a very emotional journey for her and still is. It was so nice that she had Galina there with her. It's also kind of great to see that she rose to the moment all on her own. Skate of the night and moment of the night for me.

Great work from Gracie and Polina too. I see a lot of potential in Polina. She's unpolished, her skating/packaging to me still has a very junior look to it, but of course that will come in time. Gracie really was ready for this moment. Frank worked his magic yet again. Props to them both!

 

[jatale]

I think the US Ladies 2014 Olympic Team should be Gracie, Ashley, and Mirai. Polina, if she proves herself in the next four years, will be 19 for the 2018 Olympics, that is her time. This is Ashley's last time, she and Gracie secured the 3 places for the US at the 2014 Olympics, she's had a great year, she deserves to go.

 

[demarinis5]

Congrats. to Gracie on her first US Nationals Title! Wow she really shined at this competition.
Thrilled for Mirai, no meltdown for her this year. I am still trying to get my head wrapped around
Polina winning the Silver. No judgment, just surprised.

That said Congratulations to the medalists, well done ladies!

Sorry about Ashley, hugs to her.

 

[travelbug]

Hmmmm I wonder why the USFSA is planning on announcing the teams at noon tomorrow instead of after the mens event. The US can have two subs for the team event right? While certainly not ideal it would be a way to get all four women at the Olympics.

Again... far from ideal but still an option.

They could also have Denney and Coughlin sub for Castelli and Shnapir in the long program of the team event.

<snip]

That would be a very interesting solution...

Wonder why no one (that I've seen) nor any of the articles, have mentioned that as a possible scenario. And you'd think some of them would...?

Hopefully the committee and sees the lose-lose options and thinks outside the box along these lines.

While it wouldn't be the same, it would be still skating in the Olympics and for a medal. And it would seemingly really smooth over the disgruntledness of the whole thing! Not that it'd be a perfect solution, but certainly one I hope they are giving serious consideration to.

From the ISU statement:

In general only skaters/couples already qualified for the individual events at the Olympic Winter Games will compete. However, in order to complete a team the NOCs, if necessary and applicable, can make one entry (for one discipline) according to the “Additional Athletes Quota”. Each team must participate in at least three disciplines.

With only being able to make one entry for one discipline, if it was done, it'd surely be with the Ladies given the significantly greater interest in that then the other divisions, most notably in pairs.

 

[ice coverage]

Hmmmm I wonder why the USFSA is planning on announcing the teams at noon tomorrow instead of after the mens event. The US can have two subs for the team event right? While certainly not ideal it would be a way to get all four women at the Olympics.

(1) USFS is holding two pressers today to announce different parts of the Olympic team.

~ At 7:10 pm, USFS will announce the Olympic team for the men's discipline and for the team event.
~ At noon, the fed will announce the Olympic team for the other three disciplines.​

(2) Impossible for four Ladies from one country to skate in the Olympic team event -- in which each country has only one entry per discipline. Even if USFS chooses to make a substitution in the Ladies discipline, the result would be one Lady skating the team SP and a second Lady skating the team FS. The maximum would be two Ladies in the team event.

(The structure of the Olympic team event is not the same as WTT.)

 

[yunasashafan]

You cannot bring extra athletes just for the team event. All team event participants have to be from the individual event entries. The two substitutions mean that you can have a different lady, for example, skate the team event LP than the one who skated the team SP. You can do that for two disciplines out of four. The substitutions can therefore happen only in the disciplines where the country has qualified more than one spot. For example, Russia has only one spot for Men, therefore whoever is picked as their Men entry has to skate both SP and LP in the team event. They can substitute in other events though since they have two Ladies and three Pairs and Dance entries.

ETA golden411 beat me to it

 

[leafygreens]

Sasha did GP series during the previous season.

With that logic, Samantha Cesario should be named to the team over Polina, because Samantha has GP experience.

 

[shanm]

With that logic, Samantha Cesario should be named to the team over Polina, because Samantha has GP experience.

That wouldn't make sense when three ladies with senior GP experience placed ahead of her.

 

[skatingfan4ever]

Ashley I'm not her biggest fan, but it was heartbreaking to watch her FS. I think she wanted it a bit too much; the whole competition she seemed very tight this year. The kiss and cry just broke my heart. This is one of the most shocking Ladies outcomes that I can remember - wow.

Gracie was fantastic - too bad she stepped out of one jump, but the FS went a lot better than I feared it would. Congrats to her for winning the title!

Polina was a breath of fresh air. Everybody else seemed so nervous and tense, but she just went out with a big smile and fearless attack. I loved her!

Mirai skated the best she has in a long time! Congrats to her! To see her burst into tears in the kiss and cry was so heartwarming. I didn't think she had ANY shot at the team, but this shows that all the predictions don't matter in the end and you never know what will happen.

What will USFSA do? I think Polina and Gracie are going for sure. Choreographically, I HATE Mirai's FS. It's super slow and she just goes from element to element with no expression whatsoever. Ashley's program is far better and she can finish much higher internationally. I do think USFSA will go with the top three as usual, but we shall see. I can't believe this happened to Ashley AGAIN! If they'd had three spots in Vancouver, she would've gone, but they didn't, and now WITH three spots, she STILL probably won't get to go. Unbelievable.

ETA: Just read that Wagner was put on the team over Nagasu. She must be breathing a sigh of relief. May she skate better in Sochi.

 

[Icey]

I like Barbie Long's dress.

Yes, that was really a beautiful and stylish dress.

 

[Mathman]

With that logic, Samantha Cesario should be named to the team over Polina, because Samantha has GP experience.

Samantha did have a cool program, though.

 

[Icey]

Sandra is saying the stupidist things. During Jeremy,,,,,,,,,,, "In a way he's fallen out of favor and must earn his spot back on the olympic team" So...........if your in favor you dont have to earn your spot??

Yes, Sandra, always does that and I really can't stand it when she really thinks she can read skater's minds. Do like it when she contradicts mr gee weez Scott Hamilton who doesn't contribute much except to irritate. Terry is the most reasoned in the bunch. Actually, I wish they would all shut up till the performance is over.