Patrick Chan

[4everchan]

It's ok lol I was only saying that because I've been out West for over the last week and then some I'm usually in the same time zone as you and mr4eversuspenders4chan but I travel with what I do so here I sit in Idaho!:hap57:

And 4everchannie didn't know where Pickering is?!?? Even I know that!

hey!!! what's with the name calling.... no no no... it's 4everchan

regarding Pickering... i had heard of it but didn't know exactly where it was in Ontario... and that's fine... I am way more interested in Pickling...

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

hey!!! what's with the name calling.... no no no... it's 4everchan

regarding Pickering... i had heard of it but didn't know exactly where it was in Ontario... and that's fine... I am way more interested in Pickling...

 

[4everchan]

:handw:

 

[m0001]

This is from Patrick's latest interview. I wondered whether it's worth the pain of trying his new quad flip? What do you people think?
"How much does it hurt to try to pull one of those off in a routine? And three? Or four?
PC: It might not hurt, because if you're going to put it in a routine, at that point, you're hopefully landing it more consistently. You're landing it more often than you're falling on it. Learning it, out of competition — before it gets put in a program — that's the part that hurts. I remember trying a quad flip three weeks ago. I did the first one, and I fell. I made enough of the rotations that I fell on my big muscles. But then I went up and did another one, with the same level of confidence, and didn't quite make it around enough. It was completely on my hip. I couldn't skate for two days, or jump properly for two days, just because my hip was so bruised."

 

[4everchan]

This is from Patrick's latest interview. I wondered whether it's worth the pain of trying his new quad flip? What do you people think?
"How much does it hurt to try to pull one of those off in a routine? And three? Or four?
PC: It might not hurt, because if you're going to put it in a routine, at that point, you're hopefully landing it more consistently. You're landing it more often than you're falling on it. Learning it, out of competition — before it gets put in a program — that's the part that hurts. I remember trying a quad flip three weeks ago. I did the first one, and I fell. I made enough of the rotations that I fell on my big muscles. But then I went up and did another one, with the same level of confidence, and didn't quite make it around enough. It was completely on my hip. I couldn't skate for two days, or jump properly for two days, just because my hip was so bruised."

Well in fact, you are asking 2 questions

1) Will Patrick go for 4 quads in the free? If that's the goal, then he needs the 4 flip...

2) If Patrick doesn't go for 4 quads, then, what's the point having a 4flip?

For Sp, it's simple.... 4flip gives him a couple more points than 4s... and that way he is pretty much on par with everyone but Nathan and perhaps Vincent who do 4lz and 4f

For Lp... it depends... i have the feeling that Patrick is testing the waters to replace the 4s.... with the 4flip.

That way the layout would remain similar but have a couple more points. (4t-3t, 4t, 4f instead of 4t-3t, 4t, 4s)

However, if he were to feel great with all 3 quads but not want to do 4 in the same lp... he could do

4t-3t, 4s, 4f, 3a, 3a-1/2lo-3s, 3lz,3lz-2t, 3f or 3lo which raises again the BV slightly

of course, it would be a dream if he were able to do something like this clean

4t-3t, 4f, 4s, 3a-1/2lo-3s, 4t, 3a, 3lz-2t, 3f or 3lo

so i guess it would be worth it

personally, i just want to see it... as i think it will be gorgeous like his 4s... i also trust Patrick not to compromise his health. He has said it many times, that he wants to be able to get out of the sport healthy and not in a wheelchair... so i would think that he is cautious....

Now, we haven't seen the LP... but we know the song... and perhaps if the long intro (from the studio version) is used, that kind of music allows for a lot of jumping... Maybe Patrick will go against what he said previously and do 4 quads???? and he could with that song....

long post to say that actually we don't know enough yet but i have a feeling that Patrick just doesn't want to have unused potential.. He was able to do 4S since he was 19-20... he could have added it to is repertoire.. he didn't... and if he had had 2 quad SP at the games, or 3 quad LP, maybe things would have been different..... he had a PCS cushion until Sochi.... now he is not even the front runner in PCS... so he needs to gain back with TES.

 

[vivley]

Oh sweet! I lived in Niagara Falls for the last decade, from 2006 until January of this year, which is only a ten minute drive on the highway from St. Catharines.

I moved back to my hometown in January due to.... errrr, personal reasons... anyway, it's about halfway between St. Catharines and Hamilton, so it's maybe 20 minutes away in the opposite direction. I still venture to St. Catharines/Niagara quite frequently, as my daughter does summer skating in the falls 3x a week.

Wow! You know... The other day, I met a guy who works at the Canadian Consulate and struck up a conversation with him about my trip to Niagara and Canada. To my pleasant surprise, he said that St. Catharines was his home town!

It's a small world, indeed!

Sorry my friends, my stereotypical Ontario-centric mentality was showing again.

No problem, that seems to be the center of action, anyway.

I thought it was totally accurate way to describe this newfound neck of the woods, simply because I'm a rare visitor to any of the fan fest threads; instead you'll mostly find me in either The Edge or in the Competition subforms, defending Chiddy and other (mostly Canadian) skaters against their non-fans.

Heh, I'm like that too, I'm a chronic rambler in face to face conversation, when texting or talking on the phone, and while i'm online. Brace yourselves if you'd like me to stick around.

Haha, as long as you don't mind short replies or "likes" in return. I would love to ramble with you, but find it challenging at times to balance work, family, blog, and my other artistic ambitions.

This is from Patrick's latest interview. I wondered whether it's worth the pain of trying his new quad flip? What do you people think?
"How much does it hurt to try to pull one of those off in a routine? And three? Or four?
PC: I couldn't skate for two days, or jump properly for two days, just because my hip was so bruised."

I agree with the lady on Twitter who told him to use crash pads. She's an adult skater and said, "save your hip!"

IMHO Patrick should keep training the quad flip if he has confidence in himself to learn it. In fact, since it's his last competitive skating year, he might as well pull out all of the skating tricks he has in his arsenal that he said he hasn't done in public yet.

But... he should use whatever safety equipment is available at his disposal during training, so he doesn't become crippled later in life. Just my humble opinion.


----------------

Meanwhile, here are some nice pics of him from SOI posted by Julie Larochelle Photography yesterday:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BXMPQ0vHFwn/?tagged=patrickchan

https://www.instagram.com/p/BXMOZqgnF5E/?tagged=patrickchan

https://www.instagram.com/p/BXMOP8zH7wB/?tagged=patrickchan

How happy he looks!

 

[m0001]

Thanks both vivley and 4everchan for your analyse. I just worried a little bit when I read this:"I couldn't skate for two days, or jump properly for two days, just because my hip was so bruised." He was not only hurt, but also lost 2 days of training.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Thanks both vivley and 4everchan for your analyse. I just worried a little bit when I read this:"I couldn't skate for two days, or jump properly for two days, just because my hip was so bruised." He was not only hurt, but also lost 2 days of training.

This is sadly more common than many think. Once reaching the elite level of skating your hips are pretty much holding on for dear life hence why so many singles skaters have get their hip labrum repaired. I luckily never had a labrum tear but my hip flexors are forever retired for the rest of my life lol! :hopelessness:hwell:

 

[4everchan]

Meanwhile, here are some nice pics of him from SOI posted by Julie Larochelle Photography yesterday:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BXMPQ0vHFwn/?tagged=patrickchan

https://www.instagram.com/p/BXMOZqgnF5E/?tagged=patrickchan

https://www.instagram.com/p/BXMOP8zH7wB/?tagged=patrickchan

How happy he looks!

looks like this could work for his SP outfit... and since Patrick doesn't seem to like shopping for clothes LOL...

 

[m0001]

This is sadly more common than many think. Once reaching the elite level of skating your hips are pretty much holding on for dear life hence why so many singles skaters have get their hip labrum repaired. I luckily never had a labrum tear but my hip flexors are forever retired for the rest of my life lol! :hopelessness:hwell:

Thanks Rabbit for your explanation, and for sharing with us your personal experience!

 

[4everchan]

Confession :

I have been training my ears and brain all week with Patrick's new songs.... i put them on repeat until I can no longer hear them .... i am forcing myself to get so used to them that I will end up loving them.

Now... this is unconditional love

:agree2:

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Confession :

I have been training my ears and brain all week with Patrick's new songs.... i put them on repeat until I can no longer hear them .... i am forcing myself to get so used to them that I will end up loving them.

Now... this is unconditional love

:agree2:

I am so proud of you!

Very much unconditional love, because otherwise your name wouldn't be 4everchan!

 

[skatingfan4ever]

Heh, I'm like that too, I'm a chronic rambler in face to face conversation, when texting or talking on the phone, and while i'm online. Brace yourselves if you'd like me to stick around.

Please do stick around! :yes:

I agree with the lady on Twitter who told him to use crash pads. She's an adult skater and said, "save your hip!"

IMHO Patrick should keep training the quad flip if he has confidence in himself to learn it. In fact, since it's his last competitive skating year, he might as well pull out all of the skating tricks he has in his arsenal that he said he hasn't done in public yet.

But... he should use whatever safety equipment is available at his disposal during training, so he doesn't become crippled later in life. Just my humble opinion.


----------------

Meanwhile, here are some nice pics of him from SOI posted by Julie Larochelle Photography yesterday:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BXMPQ0vHFwn/?tagged=patrickchan

https://www.instagram.com/p/BXMOZqgnF5E/?tagged=patrickchan

https://www.instagram.com/p/BXMOP8zH7wB/?tagged=patrickchan

How happy he looks!

Those are three gorgeous pics!!! And I :agree: with what you wrote about the 4F.

Confession :

I have been training my ears and brain all week with Patrick's new songs.... i put them on repeat until I can no longer hear them .... i am forcing myself to get so used to them that I will end up loving them.

Now... this is unconditional love

I am so proud of you!

Very much unconditional love, because otherwise your name wouldn't be 4everchan!

:yay: I've only listened to them both once all the way through, so you are showing real dedication. The melodies and some of the lyrics were stuck in my head for the rest of the day. So, they are memorable in that way. I am very curious what the storylines in Patrick's head are going to be and if he'll give us more about that once the season starts. Here's some good storylines in my mind:

SP - Patrick's skating career has gone by so quickly, like dust in the wind. Looking back at his career, he's grateful for every moment, but he realizes it's fleeting because he can't compete forever. I hope he's not afraid that people will forget him like dust in the wind.

LP - This one is harder to decide on. Patrick's skating career has been full of challenges and ups and downs, and there are times he's felt broken (too dramatic???). I'm thinking after Sochi he felt this way somewhat and that's why he took the year off to recharge. Or even his reevaluating things after Boston Worlds. But looking back at these hard times (these broken hallelujahs), he recognizes them as a valuable part of his skating journey. All of his experiences have made his skating career what it is, and as a whole, it's a beautiful thing. (I'm not sure if Cohen's lyrics come to that settled conclusion or not -- maybe that's just me wanting a settled conclusion???)

If anyone else has any thoughts, please share them. You can even tell me how wrong I am.

 

[4everchan]

If anyone else has any thoughts, please share them. You can even tell me how wrong I am.

hehe ... i don't think your interpretations are wrong but I somewhat hope he won't have these things in his mind when he performs.... it's very hard to have a "goodbye" performance... it makes this bigger than it should be. I'd prefer no story lines at all in Patrick's head... fans can all them for him I'd like him to be thinking about his choreography when he is on the ice... for instance, okokok step step step..4t-3t... okokok next... turn turn turn 4s... etc

just thinking about what they have concocted and making it as gorgeous as it can be....

popular belief is that when a musician plays something, they think about a story etc.... but nope... we think about where our fingers have to go next and the story, if the fingers have been well trained, will emerge from there I believe the same can be done in skating and would help the athletes a lot.

 

[happylife]

Confession :

I have been training my ears and brain all week with Patrick's new songs.... i put them on repeat until I can no longer hear them .... i am forcing myself to get so used to them that I will end up loving them.

Now... this is unconditional love

:agree2:

My heartfelt salute to Mr 4EVERCHAN for his truly amazing unconditional love and loyalty to Pchiddy and this FF.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

hehe ... i don't think your interpretations are wrong but I somewhat hope he won't have these tings in his mind when he performs.... it's very hard to have a "goodbye" performance... it makes this bigger than it should be. I'd prefer no story lines at all in Patrick's head... fans can all them for him I'd like him to be thinking about his choreography when he is on the ice... for instance, okokok step step step..4t-3t... okokok next... turn turn turn 4s... etc

just thinking about what they have concocted and making it as gorgeous as it can be....

popular belief is that when a musician plays something, they think about a story etc.... but nope... we think about where our fingers have to go next and the story, if the fingers have been well trained, will emerge from there I believe the same can be done in skating and would help the athletes a lot.

Yes but most of the time you aren't hardcore thinking about the steps because that's what ends up being your demise in the end as a figure skater. Hence why the choreographers vision and skaters as well is focused on (that is after the steps are learned and skated until they are embedded on ones brain). Truly letting the muscle memory take over is key.

It gives the skater a mecca to reach as well as something to focus on other than step step 4F, step, flying camel etc...

I understand your comparison to the music world but it's just not like that and most likely wouldn't work and would lead to even more "headcase skaters."

 

[4everchan]

Yes but most of the time you aren't hardcore thinking about the steps because that's what ends up being your demise in the end as a figure skater. Hence why the choreographers vision and skaters as well is focused on (that is after the steps are learned and skated until they are embedded on ones brain). Truly letting the muscle memory take over is key.

It gives the skater a mecca to reach as well as something to focus on other than step step 4F, step, flying camel etc...

I understand your comparison to the music world but it's just not like that and most likely wouldn't work and would lead to even more "headcase skaters."

I am not sure I explained clearly what I mean but on the contrary, I believe that headcase skaters come from something else... it comes from performance anxiety relating to focusing on results rather than process, so yes, in that sense, focus on every detail of a program will lead to failure since as soon as something isn't perfect, headcasing will occur...

but that's not what I am suggesting here... I am suggesting an awareness of the time present rather than thinking about what the performances will mean in the scope of Patrick's career... he certainly doesn't need to put pressure on himself to reach perfect performances here BECAUSE it's his last game. I believe taking one element at a time is a better approach, being in the present and embracing his time on the ice rather than the "omg... this is my last time at the games... i must do well"

that's to me the way to stress and headcase when a performer thinks ahead of himself and thinks about the "posterity" of his performances.


So for us, musicians, and keep in mind that when I mentioned step step step... i don't mean that the skater will over analyze every cross over... and musicians also rely on muscle memory and training... keep in mind that we memorize recitals that can be 2 hours long... not 4 minutes... and that they comprise many more "elements" than a figure skater simply because while a skater takes x amount of time to do a step, a pianist will have time to do perhaps 10 movements... fingers on the keyboard move faster than feet on the ice... that's just a given....

so nope... we don't freak out about the million gestures our body will go through during a recital nor do we focus on everyone of them... and i am not saying a skater needs to do that either.

My point is more about going from one element to the other, being in the present moment and NOT in the head thinking about the consequences of the skate or its finality as being the last competitive skate. This is why I am not agreeing about him thinking about it being a swansong.... I mean some skaters refuse to even say it's their final season just for that reason.

Finally, Patrick (and Gabby if I am not mistaken), have both said in different interviews that when they perform well is when they are able to focus on one element after the other, remaining in the present. So, that's what I meant here....

I don't believe at all in shutting one's brain and only rely on muscle memory. The first thing we deal with when working on performance anxiety is exactly that... the comments like 'omg... it went so fast, i don't remember how anything went, I relied only on my training" well... there is only ONE way for this to succeed and that's when a performance goes without any trouble whatsoever. How many times have we seen clean performances lately? and i am not talking just about Patrick? The men are risking a lot more with all the quads and the intricate choreography. They need to be aware of the present and not blank out and rely only on muscle memory...

Anyways... that's how I see things.

 

[m0001]

I am not sure I explained clearly what I mean but on the contrary, I believe that headcase skaters come from something else... it comes from performance anxiety relating to focusing on results rather than process, so yes, in that sense, focus on every detail of a program will lead to failure since as soon as something isn't perfect, headcasing will occur...

but that's not what I am suggesting here... I am suggesting an awareness of the time present rather than thinking about what the performances will mean in the scope of Patrick's career... he certainly doesn't need to put pressure on himself to reach perfect performances here BECAUSE it's his last game. I believe taking one element at a time is a better approach, being in the present and embracing his time on the ice rather than the "omg... this is my last time at the games... i must do well"

that's to me the way to stress and headcase when a performer thinks ahead of himself and thinks about the "posterity" of his performances.


So for us, musicians, and keep in mind that when I mentioned step step step... i don't mean that the skater will over analyze every cross over... and musicians also rely on muscle memory and training... keep in mind that we memorize recitals that can be 2 hours long... not 4 minutes... and that they comprise many more "elements" than a figure skater simply because while a skater takes x amount of time to do a step, a pianist will have time to do perhaps 10 movements... fingers on the keyboard move faster than feet on the ice... that's just a given....

so nope... we don't freak out about the million gestures our body will go through during a recital nor do we focus on everyone of them... and i am not saying a skater needs to do that either.

My point is more about going from one element to the other, being in the present moment and NOT in the head thinking about the consequences of the skate or its finality as being the last competitive skate. This is why I am not agreeing about him thinking about it being a swansong.... I mean some skaters refuse to even say it's their final season just for that reason.

Finally, Patrick (and Gabby if I am not mistaken), have both said in different interviews that when they perform well is when they are able to focus on one element after the other, remaining in the present. So, that's what I meant here....

I don't believe at all in shutting one's brain and only rely on muscle memory. The first thing we deal with when working on performance anxiety is exactly that... the comments like 'omg... it went so fast, i don't remember how anything went, I relied only on my training" well... there is only ONE way for this to succeed and that's when a performance goes without any trouble whatsoever. How many times have we seen clean performances lately? and i am not talking just about Patrick? The men are risking a lot more with all the quads and the intricate choreography. They need to be aware of the present and not blank out and rely only on muscle memory...

Anyways... that's how I see things.

4everchan, this NBC video could be one of the interviews you mean:"My goal was to come in and approach this event, one step a time, one jump a time, and just enjoy the rest." "I just stay focused on doing 1st quad, and 2nd quad, and having fun, and learning how to pace myself through the program." (11:30 / 12:00)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OeruOeYMDSE

 

[4everchan]

4everchan, this NBC video could be one of the interviews you mean:"My goal was to come in and approach this event, one step a time, one jump a time, and just enjoy the rest." "I just stay focused on doing 1st quad, and 2nd quad, and having fun, and learning how to pace myself through the program." (11:30 / 12:00)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OeruOeYMDSE

yup!!! that's the one!

 

[skatingfan4ever]

hehe ... i don't think your interpretations are wrong but I somewhat hope he won't have these things in his mind when he performs.... it's very hard to have a "goodbye" performance... it makes this bigger than it should be. I'd prefer no story lines at all in Patrick's head... fans can all them for him I'd like him to be thinking about his choreography when he is on the ice... for instance, okokok step step step..4t-3t... okokok next... turn turn turn 4s... etc

just thinking about what they have concocted and making it as gorgeous as it can be....

popular belief is that when a musician plays something, they think about a story etc.... but nope... we think about where our fingers have to go next and the story, if the fingers have been well trained, will emerge from there I believe the same can be done in skating and would help the athletes a lot.

I am not sure I explained clearly what I mean but on the contrary, I believe that headcase skaters come from something else... it comes from performance anxiety relating to focusing on results rather than process, so yes, in that sense, focus on every detail of a program will lead to failure since as soon as something isn't perfect, headcasing will occur...

but that's not what I am suggesting here... I am suggesting an awareness of the time present rather than thinking about what the performances will mean in the scope of Patrick's career... he certainly doesn't need to put pressure on himself to reach perfect performances here BECAUSE it's his last game. I believe taking one element at a time is a better approach, being in the present and embracing his time on the ice rather than the "omg... this is my last time at the games... i must do well"

that's to me the way to stress and headcase when a performer thinks ahead of himself and thinks about the "posterity" of his performances.

So for us, musicians, and keep in mind that when I mentioned step step step... i don't mean that the skater will over analyze every cross over... and musicians also rely on muscle memory and training... keep in mind that we memorize recitals that can be 2 hours long... not 4 minutes... and that they comprise many more "elements" than a figure skater simply because while a skater takes x amount of time to do a step, a pianist will have time to do perhaps 10 movements... fingers on the keyboard move faster than feet on the ice... that's just a given....

so nope... we don't freak out about the million gestures our body will go through during a recital nor do we focus on everyone of them... and i am not saying a skater needs to do that either.

My point is more about going from one element to the other, being in the present moment and NOT in the head thinking about the consequences of the skate or its finality as being the last competitive skate. This is why I am not agreeing about him thinking about it being a swansong.... I mean some skaters refuse to even say it's their final season just for that reason.

Finally, Patrick (and Gabby if I am not mistaken), have both said in different interviews that when they perform well is when they are able to focus on one element after the other, remaining in the present. So, that's what I meant here....

I don't believe at all in shutting one's brain and only rely on muscle memory. The first thing we deal with when working on performance anxiety is exactly that... the comments like 'omg... it went so fast, i don't remember how anything went, I relied only on my training" well... there is only ONE way for this to succeed and that's when a performance goes without any trouble whatsoever. How many times have we seen clean performances lately? and i am not talking just about Patrick? The men are risking a lot more with all the quads and the intricate choreography. They need to be aware of the present and not blank out and rely only on muscle memory...

Anyways... that's how I see things.

Perhaps "story" was the wrong word/concept here. Let's take a program that we know was quite meaningful and successful for Patrick. Do you think he was thinking about Eric and their friendship while he was skating A Journey? I thought he said so, but I could be wrong. Perhaps thinking about Eric was the motivation to learn the program and train it every day, fine-tuning all its details, but when he was actually in competition he wasn't thinking about any of that. In which case these "stories" (not the right word, but I can't think of a better one) are for training purposes only? So, the emotion during competition comes from the choreography itself and not from the intrinsic feeling of the skater during the the program? Patrick did explain once that when he's in the zone, he's focusing on his body position, where he's putting the blade, and his breathing.

That makes sense for a skater like Patrick, but what about a skater like Ashley Wagner? She thrives on portraying a "story" rather overtly in her programs. She specifically portrayed Satine in her Moulin Rouge LP and said she related to Satine a lot (proving people wrong, the show must go on, etc). Did she not "feel" like Satine during the competition (inasmuch as fans can guess)? She certainly showed passion during that program. While we're on the topic, what do you think when people say a skater doesn't skate with emotion? If all the emotion comes from the choreography, what differentiates the bland programs from the emotional ones?

I do not need any explanation for Patrick's programs (certainly nothing like what the commentators gave for Evgenia EVERY TIME last season with the 9/11 movie :noshake. But I still would like to know why these songs were chosen and what, if anything, will inspire Patrick to skate them well. Thanks as always for sharing your perspective. It's always a good read.