2018 Nebelhorn Trophy Ladies Short Program

[neusw]

Sorry, I can't get on the Alina bandwagon. She still has that posture problem: piking forward at the waist. Sooner or later, that habit will adversely affect her jumps.

She is only more piked than the usual skater when doing crossovers, so how exactly would that affect her jumping? And given the fact that we’ve seen great effortless jumping from her for 2 seasons, and she is looking strong and fit here despite growing 3 inches since the Olympics, I think she’s likely be just fine.

 

[Seruleane]

Wow, after watching the program, I realized Alina has grown so much, so it's very impressive she has kept her jumps looking as good as they are. I suspect she may not be as consistent due to the growth, but here's hoping she lands them when it matters. Her jumps are also still beautiful, and not anemic or muscled looking. She looks strong and not emaciated, so that's good. I am also a bit relieved that even though her triple flip was off with the music, she still landed it fairly well. I am always worried if she doesn't get the with the exact timing of the jump with the music, it would throw her off and she would fall. All in all, a great first competitive outing of POTO. Hope this gives her confidence for the FS and her upcoming competitions.

 

[ladyjane]

Loena was amazing! So happy to see her get such a good score. I feel like that's a good sign for this season across the board.

I've been a little bit in love with Loena since a few years, and she just is getting better and better. She was indeed amazing, did an excellent triple-triple and just great moves all over. Lovely dress, not turning her into a delicate damsel despite the pink (she still looks just powerful) or too princessy...obviously she's a queen! What I liked especially is the reaction to her score. Rather emotional really. I hope she'll keep it up tomorrow. LP's demand stamina, and it is early in the season. But I'll certainly be applauding all along! Yay!

 

[ladyjane]

Love Alina's costume (dress). She looks so mature in it, and I mean that in a totally positive way. I don't like the programme much (sorry Alina fans) but she skated well, and that's what counts in the end. Would have put Loena in front of her though in this instance, but I'm totally biased (see my earlier post about Loena). Good to see she's actually improving - yes even Olympic champions can improve. Good for her!

 

[Baron Vladimir]

To clarify my CO comment earlier:



Yes, she has variety in her program but CO is not really about that. The lack of cohesion has a lot to do with the jarring music cuts. Being so disjointed, it affects the overall purpose of the program. What is the program trying to get across with dozens of cuts and sound effects? I don't see the concept, the vision, or a general set of moods. It's very chaotic. And in regards to phrase and form, her choreographer is cutting and attaching different pieces together, many cuts just for a few steps or one element. Daniil is essentially trying to restructure the music to match the movements and elements rather than choreographing the routine to the music, if you get what I mean. This is why I think her composition mark should be lower.

When i mention variety i meant variety of all skating elements, body movements and placing of elements in the space/rink. This is equal with (more difficult) pattern, (wider) use of space, design of (more different) movements, and originality (cause it contains more variations of usual). If you cant see the purpose of the programme, i cant help you. But mood is there. Chaotic is a mood also But what Danill did is not suppose to be judged by the judges, only what Zagitova did. I mean we can like or not like concept of the program, but that is not the same like evaluation what skater actually did on the ice with the program he/she had gotten(?!)..

 

[BillNeal]

When i mention variety i meant variety of all skating elements, body movements and placing of elements in the space/rink. This is equal with (more difficult) pattern, (wider) use of space, design of (more different) movements, and originality (cause it contains more variations of usual). If you cant see the purpose of the programme, i cant help you. But mood is there. Chaotic is a mood also But what Danill did is not suppose to be judged by the judges, only what Zagitova did. I mean we can like or not like concept of the program, but that is not the same like evaluation what skater actually did on the ice with the program he/she had gotten(?!)..

The arrangement of movements/choreography is done by Daniil. Of course, it should be reflected in the CO component. Two out 5 bullet points lacking should not equal to a 9.1/10 overall component mark. The program is too much a series of unfinished, difficult-looking moves amid scattered music cuts to present a story, connect with the audience, and/or interpret the character of the music (part of another component but is also a purpose of a program). I think Alina has a lot of potential and deserves much better material than what she is given. I want to see her with a program that would allow her to develop and that she enjoys skating to (not just with a rehearsed smile in parts). Judges giving inflated CO for Daniil's work does not help her grow.

 

[[email protected]]

When i mention variety i meant variety of all skating elements, body movements and placing of elements in the space/rink. This is equal with (more difficult) pattern, (wider) use of space, design of (more different) movements, and originality (cause it contains more variations of usual). If you cant see the purpose of the programme, i cant help you. But mood is there. Chaotic is a mood also But what Danill did is not suppose to be judged by the judges, only what Zagitova did. I mean we can like or not like concept of the program, but that is not the same like evaluation what skater actually did on the ice with the program he/she got...

Apparently all the judges saw the concept and its realization in Alina's performance...but the Canadian one who gave Alina the lowest marks across the board. At the same time, Ms. Leblanc-Richard saw something in Alaine Chartrand that others did not see giving her higher marks in each of 5 areas. Like 7.5 vs. 6.85 average for composition. It just proves that not only spectators but judges watch the same performances and see different things.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

^^^
Not really BillNeal. This is a skating competition, not a competition of the choreographs work. Judges are not suppose to judge choreography per se, only what skater did with it on the exact day of the competition, which is part of the composition mark. Skaters are able to score perfect score in CO no matter what is the choreographers idea behind it (if that program involve general requirements/prescribed elements of the program by ISU while intention/ability for 'storytelling'/emoting/awerness of the music and audience is visible during skating).

 

[Seren]

Alina was lovely- this was her first competition since Worlds right? That had to add some extra pressure. I dislike her program (POTO is bad enough without cramming the entire musical in 2.5 minutes) but this is not a reflection of her skating. If it bothers me that much I'll mute it and just enjoy her beautiful skating!

I was so happy for Loena, I hope she has a great year. She is so talented- she could really challenge for the podium.

Mariah was a pleasant surprise. She clearly put in the work during the off season.

Not sure what's going on with Marin but I would give her time- she only recently changed her training location and coaches. I'm going to wait a while before sounding the alarm.

 

[georgia]

I am glad Alina delivered today, but with her growth, she is more prone to mistakes now, especially in the LP. But I don't she will have a major struggle, because she was a good jumper.

Marin on the other hand is very worrisome. She had some serious struggles with her jumps at the end of last season. Some people saying its because she lost motivation or her coach paid all of her attention to Satako... From her sp here, it seems all of her jumps lack height. She didn't improve but has got worse, unless she is injured or has a flu or something like that, a technical coach may not save her career

Expect to see results due to the coaching change in about a year or more. The new coach might take her jumps apart and re teach them. It’s a process.

 

[draqq]

Alina performed extremely well with the technical elements and deserves a score in the high 70s, but I agree that the program's musical edits are terrifyingly bad. I see that Alina is doing everything she can with the music she's been given and doing the choreography as best as she can, as heinous as the music cuts are. I think there are NINE different pieces garishly slapped together in a nonsensical smorgasbord of Phantom of the Opera all into three minutes.

Let's really break this down:

Phantom Dialogue --> Intro (jump, spin) --> Crash Sound Effect --> "Think of Me" (footwork, 2A) --> Thunder Crash --> Light Theme Section (spin) --> Fanfare Reprise (3F) --> Added Cut That Doesn't End With Resolution (Spin) --> Added Resolution

Where the program loses me is after the footwork sequence. After showing Alina's softness and lyrical quality, the musical edits become ridiculous and overwrought. All it really needs is one passage to finish the three-act structure they have going, not five vignettes of some shambling semblance of an ending.

 

[Dr. Jenn]

I just got around to watching the performances. The last group was pretty impressive!

Marin: This was a rough skate. I don't see any particular improvements in her skating, and her jumps really lacked power and height. As much as I enjoy Postmodern Jukebox, I wish that she had used the original version of this song. It would have been edgier and matched the costume better (which I liked). As always, she has great skating skills and good ice coverage.

Alina: I'll start by saying that I'm impressed that she has maintained her jumps as well as she has, given her growth spurt. She has always had good jumping technique though, much better than most of the Eteri skaters, so I'm not totally shocked. However, this program is a shambles. How many pieces of music do we really need in a SP?? It felt like one piece/sound effect per element. Alina still needs to work on her posture and on completing her movements. There was a lot of arm/leg flailing that did not show extension or purpose. I definitely think that her PCS scores, save for transitions, are much too high.

Mariah: This was a very solid skate by Mariah. She is a well-rounded skater and has a nice presence on the ice, but I just never feel anything from her skating. It's either cutesy or just generically nice. I like this piece of music, but I think that the choreographer could have done a lot more with it. The program seemed empty in parts.

Loena: I haven't seen much of her skating before, but I definitely think that she can make a name for herself this season. She seems very strong and powerful, as well as being well-rounded. I don't like this Celine Dion song as well as 'Love You More', but I prefer Loena's choreography over Mariah's choreography. I also like Loena's dress better - The back was especially nice.

Mai: Like Mariah, Mai is another skater with whom I have never really connected. She is very competent in all areas of her skating, but it's always just 'generically lovely' to me. Her dress was way too frilly/over the top for my liking.

 

[Jaana]

Zagitova: Excellent choreography to the music (cuts), I just love this program!!! And well skated, too...

 

[draqq]

And wow, the judges are finally responding to Leona Hendrickx! I don't think the judges gave her Frozen short program last year the GOE it deserved, but maybe with her clean free skate at Worlds (and a top 6 finish in the free skate portion), they are finally responding to her skating.

All of her elements deserve a +2 or higher and the judges finally did so for this program. She's improved tremendously with the cleanliness of her edges and the centering of her spins. So far, the best reaction in the Kiss & Cry.

 

[rikaquegira]

Am I the only who thinks Marin was underscored on her stsq?? I can’t really tell if it deserved a lvl 4 so I’m just going to believe that it was indeed a lvl3 stsq. But that shouldn’t influence the GOE right? Because it was well executed. But she got some low GOEs on that. To me her stsq was the best of the whole event. Is there something my biased eyes are not seeing? [emoji23]

 

[largeman]

Did I just listen to two Celine Dion songs back to back?

 

[Seren]

Did I just listen to two Celine Dion songs back to back?

We should just be grateful no one skated to Titanic...

 

[Lester]

Actually the glass shattering jumps from music cut to music cut don't perplex me as much as the sudden end of the music in Alina's SP. It just kind of ends with no big moment