2022 Winter Olympics: Rhythm Dance

[discodisco]

Oh, I especially love RD because it's _the dance_ first and foremost. I don't get a story behind the routine most of the times anyway, so I'm more than happy to watch two dozens of tango or blues. So yeah, I'm very team abstract and team 'dance not a story'

I think that's the problem though. Not all dances translate well to the ice. Think, for example, of Irish Step Dancing. Back in '98 I loved Bourne and Kratz's Riverdance, and couldn't understand why G&G, Krylova&O, and Annisina&P beat the Canadians. I mean, they were moving their feet so quickly, weren't they?

But now I look back and understand that Irish Step Dancing is mostly done shoulder-to-shoulder, requiring few tight dance holds or interweaving patterns. In reality, any of the top teams could have mastered the quick dance steps b/c they were pretty much about two people skating side-by-side, individually. Don't get me wrong - I still think it was an iconic dance. However, that style doesn't really translate well to a man and a woman dancing in tight holds, etc., like (eg) a tango or jive does.

Sooooooo - we come to street dance. PC tried to translate that street dance style (I can't remember its name... sounds like Fracking or something...) to the ice, and while those sections (particularly at the beginning) were neat, they weren't really about the feet or blades or edges or turns or holds or whatever, which is what ice dancing is supposed to be about. If you look at most RDs this year, they are trying to dance according to an abstract idea/concept ('street dancing') with a random blues pattern thrown in there. Huh? What does backstreet boys have to do with a blues rhythm? Know what I mean?

Meh. Maybe I'm wrong. I just see this year's RD as an attempt to do something that doesn't make sense, and doesn't fit on the ice... Am I wrong?

 

[discodisco]

I like Johnny as a skater and a TV personality, and I remember everyone liked him and Tara when they were the B Team commentators on NBC's secondary channel- they were knowledgeable and restrained compared to Scott and Terry on the primetime feed. But I think once they became the primetime commentators NBC coached them to become more chatty and inane to pander to the (majority) non-skating fan audience.

The problem with Weir is that he depends too much on his ridiculous persona (he looks and acts like someone from the Hunger Games) and not enough on what he knows about - skating and skating skills. He is too flash and grab and tries to draw the focus to himself. He and Tara are too much like a pair of 1980's teenage girls who just found a good deal on slouch socks at the mall. Jonny is there not b/c he's good at his job (he may be - he's made some astute observations about blade control in the past) but b/c he gets attention. That's his pull. Meh. Not for me.

 

[Rere]

I think that's the problem though. Not all dances translate well to the ice. Think, for example, or Irish Step Dancing. Back in 98 I loved Bourne and Kratz's Riverdance, and couldn't understand why G&G, Krylova&O, and Annisina&P beat the Canadians. I mean, they were moving their feet so quickly, weren't they?

But now I look back at understand that Irish Step Dancing is mostly done shoulder-to-shoulder, requiring few tight dance holds or interweaving patterns. In reality, any of the top teams could have mastered the quick dance steps b/c they were pretty much about two people skating side-by-side, individually. Don't get me wrong - I still think it was an iconic dance. However, that style doesn't really translate well to a man and a woman dancing in tight holds, etc., like (eg) a tango or jive does.

Sooooooo - we come to street dance. Even with P&C, with their version of that street dance (I can't remember its name...) and while those sections (particularly at the beginning) were neat, they weren't really about the feet or blades or edges or turns or whatever, which is what ice dancing is supposed to be about. If you look at most dances, they are trying to dance according to an abstract idea/concept ('street dancing') with a random blues pattern thrown in there. What does backstreet boys have to do with a blues rhythm? Know what I mean?

Meh. Maybe I'm wrong. I just see this year's RD as an attempt to do something that doesn't make sense, and doesn't fit on the ice... Am I wrong?

I absolutely agree that not every dance translates well to the ice, or to the pair skating. And I, personally, don't really understand what the "street dance" theme is supposed to represent. Although, to me it sounds vague enough to allow teams doing what they want as long as they can sell it as a "street dance" (because the previous "musicals" theme of was extremely tiring for me, and as much as I love musicals, my eye is still twitching when I remember that season).
If I understand your concerns correctly, then the question is in deciding what the initial list of dances for ice dance should be. And I really don't know enough about ice dancing to make any informative input here. But I love watching recognizable dance patterns translated to the ice - I don't follow the sport very long, so I only witnessed tango and probably foxtrot, I loved those.

 

[discodisco]

I absolutely agree that not every dance translates well to the ice, or to the pair skating. And I, personally, don't really understand what the "street dance" theme is supposed to represent. Although, to me it sounds vague enough to allow teams doing what they want as long as they can sell it as a "street dance" (because the previous "musicals" theme of was extremely tiring for me, and as much as I love musicals, my eye is still twitching when I remember that season).
If I understand your concerns correctly, then the question is in deciding what the initial list of dances for ice dance should be. And I really don't know enough about ice dancing to make any informative input here. But I love watching recognizable dance patterns translated to the ice - I don't follow the sport very long, so I only witnessed tango and probably foxtrot, I loved those.

I think we're 100% agreed I don't know what 'street dance' is either. 'Musicals' is a theme, not a dance pattern, as far as I know. Don't remember that one. Sounds more like Dancing with the Stars or something! But yes, some dance styles work well on the ice, and others don't.

 

[Bcash]

I think while maintaining a lively connection to its roots is important, ice dance should feel free to move beyond "translating" specific dances to the ice.

 

[NanaPat]

I think we're 100% agreed I don't know what 'street dance' is either. 'Musicals' is a theme, not a dance pattern, as far as I know. Don't remember that one. Sounds more like Dancing with the Stars or something! But yes, some dance styles work well on the ice, and others don't.

I think the theme was musicals but the pattern was Finnstep (an ice dance version of quickstep based on an OD by Rahkamo and Kokko, who are long-retired Finnish ice dancers).

It was like last year!

 

[Sjs5572]

The Russian and Polish judges placements for the teams definitely raised my eyebrow..

More importantly, two out of the three tech panel judges are in the Russian Camp: Gyorgy of Hungary and Halina of Poland.

 

[rinkside_user]

Anyone who has watched CBC commentary: what was V/M's takeaway from P/C?

 

[liv]

Anyone who has watched CBC commentary: what was V/M's takeaway from P/C?

They loved them. They loved the sharp twizzles, the huge pattern, the cool choreo... said the skating world had been waiting for this, they should have mercy on the rest of the field... on and on.

 

[brigit66]

They loved them. They loved the sharp twizzles, the huge pattern, the cool choreo... said the skating world had been waiting for this, they should have mercy on the rest of the field... on and on.

too bad that they didnt say that 4 years ago, oh wait there were their rivalrs

 

[moonvine]

Here it is! https://instagram.com/stories/j_but...ce=ig_story_item_share&utm_medium=share_sheet

Go quick in 2 hours it expires

Thanks but I was sleeping. What a bummer.

 

[moonvine]

Once you learn the basic patterns it's easy to spot them on other people. This is an easy princess seam bodice on top of a circle skirt with a ruffled hem, I make similar dresses all the time.

Wow! You are talented! I can't sew on a button.

 

[4everchan]

too bad that they didnt say that 4 years ago, oh wait there were their rivalrs

you certainly cannot fault them for that...

and leaving scott and tessa out of this discussion, I believe that P/C are better than ever now. I was not a huge fan of them 4 years ago (always appreciated them but something was missing for me, and I had other preferred teams) Now, I truly root for them to win this event by a landslide ! I find that the break they took from competition was very beneficial for them. I find their material better. I find them sharper. I think they communicate better through their music. I think they have improved a lot in the RD portion of the competition, which to me was their weakness in the years leading to 2018... I believe teams can change and improve a lot in 4 years.

 

[moonvine]

LOL even his costume in the free but isnt he really American. And whenever I see him I think oh here it comes a picture of Wyatt. he is the opposite of Tom Daley who shelters his son from the media. The judging seems reaasonable. I appreciate we have different opinions. I would have had Piper and Paul higher a bit in score. I think the Aamericans look good to possibly get two medals. The comment about Nikitas glass back concerns me. Forget twizzles. The health / injury is a mystery.

It is hard for me to image anyone more Canadian than Keegan. He has citizenship through his mother I believe.

 

[brigit66]

you certainly cannot fault them for that...

and leaving scott and tessa out of this discussion, I believe that P/C are better than ever now. I was not a huge fan of them 4 years ago (always appreciated them but something was missing for me, and I had other preferred teams) Now, I truly root for them to win this event by a landslide ! I find that the break they took from competition was very beneficial for them. I find their material better. I find them sharper. I think they communicate better through their music. I think they have improved a lot in the RD portion of the competition, which to me was their weakness in the years leading to 2018... I believe teams can change and improve a lot in 4 years.

I dont agree. Their rhumba pattern was the best of the field 4 years ago, much better than V/M's. Twizzles, too.Anyway, Cizeron was the only ice dancer there who actually had moved like rhumba dancer and yet next day he moved like ballet dancer in Moonlight Sonata. Versality at its best. Tessa and Scott were the same in short and free. Horny, only horny. So I dont agree that now they have better programs. I think 4 years ago they were bigger favourites to win than now!

 

[rinkside_user]

I think 4 years ago they were bigger favourites to win than now!

Well, judging from the ice dance landscape and the results leading up to these Olympics, that's hardly true.

 

[brigit66]

Well, judging from the ice dance landscape and the results leading up to this Olympics, that's hardly true.

what ? are you serious? In 2018 they had 12 worlds records going into olympic games! Those results were not a joke. Thats hardly true for you ?
This year they are the favourities yes, but still 4 years ago they were the favourities against VM, two time olympic medalist, so it was more amazing . They didnt deserve losing like THAT. They did deserve losing fair and square.
This year are the favourites because they have to be , they would lost against sloppy and uninspired Nikita? Travesty .It would be devastating.

 

[rinkside_user]

what ? are you serious? In 2018 they had 12 worlds records going into olympic games! Those results were not a joke. Thats hardly true for you ?
This year they are the favourities yes, but still 4 years ago they were the favourities against VM, two time olympic medalist, so it was more amazing . They didnt deserve losing like THAT. They did deserve losing fair and square.
This year are the favourites because they have to be , they would lost against sloppy and uninspired Nikita? Travesty .It would be devastating.

In the previous Olympic cycle, P/C was beaten by V/M at Worlds and GPF the season before the Olympics, both teams had WRs up in their sleeves (also in an Olympic year), with V/M usually scoring better in the SD and P/C in the FD.

WRs in the previous cycle:
P/C: 14
V/M: 10

WRs in this cycle:
P/C: 16
S/K: 1

before the Olympics in 2017-2018:
P/C: 7
V/M: 2

before the Olympics in 2021-22:
P/C: 0
S/K: 0

S/K only scored a WR at the Ondrej Nepela Trophy that was due to the clean slate after the 2018 Olympics. Based on your criteria, the chances of P/C are better now and that was my point to begin with.

 

[litenkyckling]

you certainly cannot fault them for that...

and leaving scott and tessa out of this discussion, I believe that P/C are better than ever now. I was not a huge fan of them 4 years ago (always appreciated them but something was missing for me, and I had other preferred teams) Now, I truly root for them to win this event by a landslide ! I find that the break they took from competition was very beneficial for them. I find their material better. I find them sharper. I think they communicate better through their music. I think they have improved a lot in the RD portion of the competition, which to me was their weakness in the years leading to 2018... I believe teams can change and improve a lot in 4 years.

I think that despite the result being not what they wanted, 2018 is the best thing that could've happened to them. They've pushed since then and are better than they were then.

 

[brigit66]

In the previous Olympic cycle, P/C was beaten by V/M at Worlds and GPF the season before the Olympics, both teams had WRs up in their sleeves (also in an Olympic year), with V/M usually scoring better in the RD and P/C in the FD.

WRs in the previous cycle:
P/C: 14
V/M: 10

WRs in this cycle:
P/C: 16
S/K: 1

before the Olympics in 2017-2018:
P/C: 7
V/M: 2

before the Olympics in 2021-22:
P/C: 0
S/K: 0

S/K only scored a WR at the Ondrej Nepela Trophy that was due to the clean slate after the 2018 Olympics. Based on your criteria, the chances of P/C are better now and that was my point to begin with.

Sk at nepela throphy got 75.06 and 120.46 so what wr? you mixed up wr with personal best.