I think Ashley Wagner's going to become the biggest rival to Yu-na and/or Mao in 2010

[Tonichelle]

Scott Hamilton also said it was incredibly unfair to Josee to force her to go out before she was supposed to... they gave Tonya special privileges and while Josee wasn't always the best competitor, we just never know what she could have done...

 

[jsteam4501s]

I think it's a bit early to state with certainty that any one or two of the Nats top four is "superior" to the others and has "much more potential". Rachael's slower speed is offset by her greater maturity and sophistication, and by what some of you have said about the importance of speed, it's simple logic that if she had the same speed as Mirai she would have won the event. I believe right now these four are so close together in overall ability that it's impossible to predict their future placements relative to each other. I prefer to enjoy what we have in Ladies right now and let the chips fall where they may.

 

[fumie_fumie]

Scott Hamilton also said it was incredibly unfair to Josee to force her to go out before she was supposed to... they gave Tonya special privileges and while Josee wasn't always the best competitor, we just never know what she could have done...

Josee was always a joy to watch. Then, Jen Robinson came along. arrggghh. The cheated flips.

 

[georgia]

Ashley reminds of Tonya Harding.
The same jumping power, speed and movements.
In my opinion Ashely needs to adjust to today's skating.
Her dresses and choreography are both very much of the 80s.
I am very exited about her future.
I really thought she was the most promising skater in this years Nationals. The main reason, because she doesn't have to worry about puberty.
Her body doesn't have any similarities to that of Emily's.
Ashley is slim. She just needs the right costume.
Her Triple toe/ triple loop combo was the best at Nationals. So huge and so powerful. Also get the kid some real choreography.

 

[ks777]

Ashley reminds of Tonya Harding.
The same jumping power, speed and movements.
In my opinion Ashely needs to adjust to today's skating.
Her dresses and choreography are both very much of the 80s.
I am very exited about her future.
I really thought she was the most promising skater in this years Nationals. The main reason, because she doesn't have to worry about puberty.
Her body doesn't have any similarities to that of Emily's.
Ashley is slim. She just needs the right costume.
Her Triple toe/ triple loop combo was the best at Nationals. So huge and so powerful. Also get the kid some real choreography.

I think it was a 3lutz/3loop.

 

[heyang]

Josee Chouinard, on the other hand, even with the falls was so much fun!

Absolutely!

Side note: I always thought she was thrown off her game a little in the Olys when Tonya went sobbing to the judges over her broken lace. They should've let the same amount of time elapse that Tonya's skate would've taken before they called Josee, but they didn't.

Not that Josee was a model of consistency. But,as you said, she was always fun! Real personality on the ice![/QUOTE]

I really thought that Josee's American in Paris program was great whenever she performed it well. A lot of people have sympathized with Josee for having to rush to the ice, but in interviews, she has said that she took her time before she went to her opening position.

It is possible that she might not have been as ready as she thought, but the officials did not make her start immediately and gave her some time to compose herself.

I think the judges did give Tonya more leeway that night because they did not want to be construed as punishing her for affiliating with people accused of attacking her teammate Nancy. If anything, they should have gone to commercial and had her get back on the ice with new laces.

 

[Kwanford Wife]

I don't know if you read any of my old posts but I'm one of few minority skating fans who were never impressed with Michelle Kwan's style of skating. Her skating didn't look beautiful to me like Yu-na's or Mao's do now. Regardless of whether Kwan had better posture or leg positions or not, I thought she had ugly physique (short legs, big head) which didn't do much for any of the "artistic" moves, postures, etc. she did out there. Her speed wasn't that great either. I was one of the few that tuned out of ladies figure skating during the ten years Michelle, Sasha, Irina, and Sarah ruled because none of them were beautiful to watch (in my eyes). .

While beauty & style are subjective - this is the silliest thing I've ever read... One can only wish & pray that this generation is able to overcome the ugliness that marked one of the greatest decades in ladies skating...:disapp::sheesh:

 

[R.D.]

You CAN'T please everyone. It's not humanly possible.

I was about to tune out of skating myself but I've actually been kind of re-invigorated due to seeing the talent we have coming up at Nats. This could be a fun two years if everyone stays healthy. And there's the looming question of whether Meissner will be able to snap out of her current slump. I'm willing to give her ONE last chance before I write her off. I really want to believe in her, that she can do it. But not many have been able to do so.

 

[Tonichelle]

Johnny Weir had a crappy season... now he's kicking butt and taking names... if he can do it I'm sure Kimmie's just as capable!

 

[clonesheep]

I find Ashley more like that 'tomboy up the street'. I'm sure she would do well in tennis, softball, soccer, etc. But she skates, and for that, she is a refreshing change from those sweet little cherub-like others.

Joe

Agree. Wagner is a bit like Sarah Hughes.

Ashley Wagner = The new Sarah Hughes (robust, great competitor, artistry will improve with time just enough to win OGM)

Rachel Flatt = The new Michelle Kwan (smooth, excellent flow, she wins by skating a well-balanced, whole, program rather than relying on a single killer move)

Caroline Zhang = The new Sasha Cohen (fragile, cherub-like as you said, has one or two outstanding moves but does not skate a balanced program)

Mirai Nagasu = A lesser Yu-na Kim (has about every element but not mature enough to put together a compelling program)

 

[R.D.]

Ashley Wagner = The new Sarah Hughes (robust, great competitor, artistry will improve with time just enough to win OGM)

That's so not true. the latter was not hyped to win the OGM in 2002.

 

[jsteam4501s]

Rachel Flatt = The new Michelle Kwan (smooth, excellent flow, she wins by skating a well-balanced, whole, program rather than relying on a single killer move)

Bravo, clonesheep! I love Rachael the most of the new wave.

 

[Wrlmy]

Rachel Flatt = The new Michelle Kwan (smooth, excellent flow, she wins by skating a well-balanced, whole, program rather than relying on a single killer move)

Caroline Zhang = The new Sasha Cohen (fragile, cherub-like as you said, has one or two outstanding moves but does not skate a balanced program)

Mirai Nagasu = A lesser Yu-na Kim (has about every element but not mature enough to put together a compelling program)

Agree about Ashley, but,
Rachael Flatt = young Yu-na Kim

Mirai Nagasu = young Mao Asada

Caroline Zhang = Sasha-like skating and young-Kwan-like presentation

JMO

 

[ks777]

Agree. Wagner is a bit like Sarah Hughes.

Ashley Wagner = The new Sarah Hughes (robust, great competitor, artistry will improve with time just enough to win OGM)

Rachel Flatt = The new Michelle Kwan (smooth, excellent flow, she wins by skating a well-balanced, whole, program rather than relying on a single killer move)

Caroline Zhang = The new Sasha Cohen (fragile, cherub-like as you said, has one or two outstanding moves but does not skate a balanced program)

Mirai Nagasu = A lesser Yu-na Kim (has about every element but not mature enough to put together a compelling program)

I don't see any similarities between Mirai and Yuna. Mirai is more like Shizuka or Mao. Yuna reminds me of Fumie Suguri. Their spirals are so identical and they both have great death drops.

Agree about Ashley, but,
Rachael Flatt = young Yu-na Kim

Mirai Nagasu = young Mao Asada

Caroline Zhang = Sasha-like skating and young-Kwan-like presentation

JMO

Yep, that's more like it. Rachael =Yuna=fumie---- They all have good facial expressions but lacks flexibility.

 

[mandykane21]

Actually, Kwan didn't have a ton of flexibilty either. In fact, didn't she say once that she was the least flexible kid in her younger years? I hope Flatt maintains her consistency while she's growing into her body, she and Kwan actually have alot in common to me.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Actually, Kwan didn't have a ton of flexibilty either. In fact, didn't she say once that she was the least flexible kid in her younger years? I hope Flatt maintains her consistency while she's growing into her body, she and Kwan actually have alot in common to me.

Flexibility, imo, is the most overrated body movement on the boards. It has nothing to do with how one skates. What a skater should have is proper knee and toe turn out in there overall skating and not just in spirals. As for ballet-like, one should take note that real ballerinas bring their free leg up by muscle and not by help of the hand.

Edging and Flow will always get me looking especially with wide cross overs. Simply beautiful figure skating. Choppy skating is fine in footwork.

Joe

 

[mizu_iro]

Agree that Ashley Wagner is like Sarah Hughes...except with rotated jumps. Something about Sarah always struck me as clumsy, which I don't get from Ashley.

Mirai's skating doesn't really remind me of any of the Japanese ladies. Her spinning is much better than Shizuka or Mao, her jumps sort of have the "stalky" quality of Butyrskaya rather than Shizuka and Mao's super-smooth landings, and she's a much better "actress" on ice than any of the Japanese girls. If Mao or Shizuka tried to do "I Got Rhythm", it would fall flat, although I could see Mao doing Coppelia. Maybe Fumie, acutally?

Still don't get the hype about Caroline Zhang's presentation. Her skating in general is very similar to Sasha.

I can see why people would compare Rachael Flatt to Fumie and Yu-Na, she simply doesn't have the body type to present an elegant picture on the ice. Fumie and Yu-Na's oft-berated lack of stretch is offset by their thin, long limbs, but Rachael, who has better stretch, still doesn't have as much grace as the Asian girls. Her spins are also a lot slower. I think the Fumie/Yu-Na comparison is spot-on, though. Relative lack of stretch, fast spins, great toe jumps, iffy edge jumps, and a great deal of facial expressions and drama.

 

[mandykane21]

Flexibility, imo, is the most overrated body movement on the boards. It has nothing to do with how one skates. What a skater should have is proper knee and toe turn out in there overall skating and not just in spirals. As for ballet-like, one should take note that real ballerinas bring their free leg up by muscle and not by help of the hand.

Edging and Flow will always get me looking especially with wide cross overs. Simply beautiful figure skating. Choppy skating is fine in footwork.

Joe

I completly agree with you!

 

[Bennett]

As far as the comment about Kimmie Meissner.....I think the reason she doesn't get attention about her looks or healthy, wholesome look is because she does look like the girl next door. There is really nothing so outstanding about Kimmie, in my opinion. Please don't take this the wrong way as it's merely an attempt to explain why she doesn't get more praise. The same goes for her skating.

Dizzy

I know what you mean. But I think that this applies to most of the skaters. Yuna may be seen as just one of those calm girls in your classroom and Mao may be seen one of those cheerful kids in the next class if they were not skaters. The same goes with Irena, Shizuka, Emily, Sarah, Ashley, Miki, Fumie, Sasha, Michelle etc etc. They have charm of thier own but would not have been noticed by many people if they had not skated. While I think Sasha pretty as a professional skater, I cannot picture her as a Hollywood star. You can find many other attractive girls at local rinks as well as in classrooms. But I think when one of those ordinary girls has some talent to attract people' attention, people get to find all the charms in her, which makes her shine.

 

[beep_beep]

C'mon - lets allow Ashley and her counterparts a chance to develop, grow and (gasp!) even fail a bit... and worry about 2010 when its time.

Couldn't be more true !!!
I think all of these girls have their growth spurts ahead of them, once they handled it, I think I will be able to make an opinion of my own... (BTW: I really hope these girls can take puberty well, and adapt well to their (future) new bodies, including Meissner... or it will be such a waste of talent...)

Flexibility, imo, is the most overrated body movement on the boards. It has nothing to do with how one skates. What a skater should have is proper knee and toe turn out in there overall skating and not just in spirals. As for ballet-like, one should take note that real ballerinas bring their free leg up by muscle and not by help of the hand.

Edging and Flow will always get me looking especially with wide cross overs. Simply beautiful figure skating. Choppy skating is fine in footwork.

Joe

Flexibility can (and it should) be trained (meaning: improved) !
A person's flexibility can be improved as much as 70% (opposed to velocity, for runners, which can be improved by about 30%). And that's for anyone, athlete or not. (I have some friends on the Physical Education department....)
I'm a major ballet fan (ballet training gives you wonderful posture and sense of body balance/awareness/movement) but getting ballet-like positions with an extra kilo on your foot, it's not easy... Ashley is 16... give her some time.

As for flow, I think it has a lot to do with musicality... whether that can be trained or not...

I thimk the point of this whole discussion is: Ashley (and the age-inelegible girls) are great now. But let's give them time to develop (physically and artistically)...