2025 Lombardia Trophy Women's Free Skate

[Karoltyna]

see you tomorrow in the cacti greenhouse. love you all (i can't wait to see what Michelangelo looks like (

I'm scared but still want to see it (I know the starting pose...)

 

[labgoat]

Crazy event...not sure what to say. I have no words except I am so happy for Rion - she was magnificent as was the much underscored Lara who was spectacular.

 

[labgoat]

Now off to get some sleep - see you tomorrow.
Videos in the rewatch for as long as they last

 

[brblja]

For those who were able to watch - were the jumps really so terrible across the board, or is Ms. Tauchmanova of the Shina Amano school of tech judging and was catching all the things that usually people can get away with?

 

[Karoltyna]

Katia managed to UR the euler... Good thing I already decided I'm alive.

 

[Skater Boy]

Our gold medallists was a delight and shows th edepth of Japan. Good for Sarah winning the bronze. I appreciate Alyssa trying something news including tricks. We will see how she grows into the program or goes back to last year's Too early now. Now a days even the top skaters tend to have "forced" artistry. Wherass Kerrigan, Baiul, Kwan, Cohen, Butyrskaya - there ws something organic about their artistry and skating. Now the skaters including the top men and ladies seem "forrced" like over exaggerated moves and lunges equals artistry. The one thing I noticed about Liu is her skating does not seem as fast as some and kind of "neavy" if that makes sense

 

[Jammers]

Our gold medallists was a delight and shows th edepth of Japan. Good for Sarah winning the bronze. I appreciate Alyssa trying something news including tricks. We will see how she grows into the program or goes back to last year's Too early now. Now a days even the top skaters tend to have "forced" artistry. Wherass Kerrigan, Baiul, Kwan, Cohen, Butyrskaya - there ws something organic about their artistry and skating. Now the skaters including the top men and ladies seem "forrced" like over exaggerated moves and lunges equals artistry. The one thing I noticed about Liu is her skating does not seem as fast as some and kind of "neavy" if that makes sense

The last thing i would ever say about Nancy's skating was it was organic if anything she was stiff at times.

 

[museksk8r]

The last thing i would ever say about Nancy's skating was it was organic if anything she was stiff at times.

Absolutely, Kerrigan’s choreography was often stiff and her interpretation and presentation was often wooden. Kerrigan never appeared to enjoy skating to me. This is where fans confuse the terms packaging and artistry. Nancy’s packaging was first rate and her costuming made her look more expensive than she actually was; her artistry and presentation were definitely not though. Maria Butyrskaya had stiff knees when she skated, but her packaging also made her skating look more expensive. Oksana Baiul lived her music and she felt and interpreted it with all of her soul and she skated super fast. Her 1993 Worlds short program will always stay in my memory. Michelle Kwan was the first skater to make me cry watching her; in particular, her Fields of Gold exhibition at the 2002 Olympics. Her 1996 season short program and free skate as they were skated at Worlds were both masterpieces. Nicole Bobek when she was “on” could sell any performance. Her exhibition to “Sacrifice” in 1995 also lives in my memory. Jason Brown and Kevin Aymoz are skaters of today who master the art of skating organically in an artistic sense.

 

[museksk8r]

The one thing I noticed about Liu is her skating does not seem as fast as some and kind of "neavy" if that makes sense

Alysa was slow and appeared that she had not performed too many run-throughs of her FS. Isabeau appeared the same way weeks ago at Cranberry. Alysa, however, didn’t have the benefit of skating her season debut in the US. There will be fans who constantly post the scores for skaters in the Challenger Series and they will compare what Alysa scored here in Italy versus what Levito scored in the USA at Cranberry, where Isabeau was egregiously overscored despite a very shaky performance with her usual problematic jump technique and allowed to win an event that she shouldn’t have. Oh well. It won’t be the first or last time that Isabeau is wrongfully held up.

 

[Violet Sky]

Oh, Everhardt got bronze after all. Okay, I am on board with this too.

Congratulations on your bronze Sarah - well done.

 

[Violet Sky]

Congratulations on your bronze Sarah - well done.

Alysa was slow and appeared that she had not performed too many run-throughs of her FS. Isabeau appeared the same way weeks ago at Cranberry. Alysa, however, didn’t have the benefit of skating her season debut in the US. There will be fans who constantly post the scores for skaters in the Challenger Series and they will compare what Alysa scored here in Italy versus what Levito scored in the USA at Cranberry, where Isabeau was egregiously overscored despite a very shaky performance with her usual problematic jump technique and allowed to win an event that she shouldn’t have. Oh well. It won’t be the first or last time that Isabeau is wrongfully held up.

It was reported that Alysa was having boot issues. She did seem a bit tentative; She has time before Skate America to make some changes, practice, maybe insert a cartwheel into the step sequence for the FS.

 

[Jammers]

It was reported that Alysa was having boot issues. She did seem a bit tentative; She has time before Skate America to make some changes, practice, maybe insert a cartwheel into the step sequence for the FS.

Alysa even said don't expect to much here because she's skating with one old and one new boot and even has Ilia's dad helping her with her boots. At Champs Camp she couldn't even do the jumps for the competition simulation because of her boots. Her stumble at the beginning of her SP was because her boots were too tight. Like she said usually she can do the triple lutz triple loop much better then yesterday so it sounds like she's not been able to work on her harder jumps like the triple axel because of the boots.

 

[Mathman]

As a non-skater, I am always perplexed when the world's top competitors in the sport can't manage to get boots that fit or can't find the time to break in new boots, etc. Is there any other sport that has this kind of equipment issue? I have never heard a sprinter, for instance, say that the reason he couldn't run the hundred meter dash very fast was that his shoes were pinching his big toe.

 

[Karoltyna]

As a non-skater, I am always perplexed when the world's top competitors in the sport can't manage to get boots that fit or can't find the time to break in new boots, etc. Is there any other sport that has this kind of equipment issue? I have never heard a sprinter, for instance, say that the reason he couldn't run the hundred meter dash very fast was that his shoes were pinching his big toe.

Skating boots are very specific gear, not to be compared to any other gear. New boots hurt and it's friggin hard to bend knee in them, when they stop hurting, this means they are good, but won't last very long. Even skaters who won't jump more than 2S but are heavier than 50-60 kilos change boots from time to time - because of forces affecting them while jumping and spinning nad make them break. When boot is broken, there is no stability in the ankle and it is dangerous to perform things more complicated than crossovers because it can cause injury.
When you replace your boots, you virtually have to learn some elements again because boot and blade feels a little bit different than the old one, so they can't use worse boots for training and better boots for competition. Yup, skating is probably the only sport there change of equipment can make you loose skills, even if equipment is the same type as old one. And this isn't the matter of skills. Katia Kurakova had a video of trying to skate in these blue plastic rentals without toe pics - at first she wasn't doing any better than I in rentals...
Also equipment fit for elite tech content is very expensive (boot + blades - you can put old baldes on new boots, it's common for amateurs, I don't know if elite skaters do it often), so skaters rarely have more than a good pair and that other pair that barely holds thanks to fan's prayers and duck tape that they have as back up. See kids in JGP with lots of tape on their boots, probably waiting for the bigger size of boots to fit or elite skaters by the beginning and end of the season. Nikita Volodin had lots of tape on his boots at Worlds or Daniel Martynov at Cranberry and TBH it looked like he had issues due to state of his boots.
My boots are with me from some time but I'm perfectly capabe of UR 1T and 1Lo off ice and I don't even try it on ice. Some amateur skaters even stop learning jumps after singles because boots suitable for harder jumps are very expensive and have to be replaced if you skate nad perform all your content - it's not like skiing gear that you pay a lot but can use even +10 years.

(thank you for reading my TEDwrite)

 

[Mathman]

Skating boots are very specific gear, not to be compared to any other gear. New boots hurt and it's friggin hard to bend knee in them, when they stop hurting, this means they are good, but won't last very long....

Thanks so much for the detailed explanation.

What is striking to me is this: the art of shoemaking is ten thousand years old. I would have thought that over the years they would have come up with boots that don't hurt when they are new, that don't wear out so fast, that can withstand the stresses of jumping and twisting, that have the right blend of flexibility and support, etc., etc.

Maybe there just isn't enough money in the skating boot trade to invest in the necessary research? Or maybe it's just a scientific impossibility, like quantum gravity.

 

[Karoltyna]

Thanks so much for the detailed explanation.

What is striking to me is this: the art of shoemaking is ten thousand years old. I would have thought that over the years they would have come up with boots that don't hurt when they are new, that don't wear out so fast, that can withstand the stresses of jumping and twisting, that have the right blend of flexibility and support, etc., etc.

Maybe there just isn't enough money in the skating boot trade to invest in the necessary research? Or maybe it's just a scientific impossibility, like quantum gravity.

Unfortunately it's how physics works. Boots developed rapidly during last 30-40 years and this resulted with skaters jumping much more tripples and quads than before. See recordnings or photos from 60 and 70 or even 80 how boots were much lighter visually - they were mostly leather and cardboard or thin layers of plastic inside and insoles much higher than modern skates. For exapmle here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anett_Pötzsch#/media/File:Anett-Pötzsch_18-11-79.jpg
I learned to skate in older type of skates, feet pronated, ankles twisted and it's hard to compare the stability moders skates give.

 

[brblja]

It also doesn’t help that, compared to running mentioned above, this is an extremely niche sport. Pro runners do not have many equipment issues, because even top-shelf equipment is widely available (aside from some cutting-edge models that producers first give to their top sponsored athletes before it officially hits the shelves). It a huge business - and that’s why equipment manufacturers put in a lot of money into R&D, which in turn means that you hear about some new futuristic running shoe tech every other year or so.

Figure skating boots have been developing since the 80s, but at now where near the pace of equipment for popular/lucrative for manufacturers sports.

Shoemaking is very old, yes, but the thing with specialist sports shoes is that those are very new in comparison, and the techniques/materials are often things not used in day-to-day shoemaking at all.

 

[Arigato]

When boot is broken, there is no stability in the ankle and it is dangerous to perform things more complicated than crossovers because it can cause injury.

That's why when Adam's boot broke on the ice at an event right before his 3A, he described it as "feeling the boot go soft." Luckily he was not injured finishing his program with that boot. But then it's not unusual for him to have boots break right before and during events due to the way he skates. His left boot only lasts a month or so and his right boot lasts him three to four months. That's a hell of a challenge to keep up with.

 

[Karoltyna]

That's why when Adam's boot broke on the ice at an event right before his 3A, he described it as "feeling the boot go soft." Luckily he was not injured finishing his program with that boot. But then it's not unusual for him to have boots break right before and during events due to the way he skates. His left boot only lasts a month or so and his right boot lasts him three to four months. That's a hell of a challenge to keep up with.

Yes, I remeber that, even considered writting about it as an example, but that comment was already too long.

 

[Karoltyna]

It also doesn’t help that, compared to running mentioned above, this is an extremely niche sport. Pro runners do not have many equipment issues, because even top-shelf equipment is widely available (aside from some cutting-edge models that producers first give to their top sponsored athletes before it officially hits the shelves). It a huge business - and that’s why equipment manufacturers put in a lot of money into R&D, which in turn means that you hear about some new futuristic running shoe tech every other year or so.

Figure skating boots have been developing since the 80s, but at now where near the pace of equipment for popular/lucrative for manufacturers sports.

Shoemaking is very old, yes, but the thing with specialist sports shoes is that those are very new in comparison, and the techniques/materials are often things not used in day-to-day shoemaking at all.

Yup, in Poland are literally 2 places where you can buy Grafs - unfortunately this is brand that suits me and my son best. Edeas and Risports are available in about 10 shops, but not full range of models and sizes. Lower models of Jacksons are reliatively easy to buy, but may be problem with specific size. And boots are more expensive than in countries with FS culture.