2015 Cup of China Mens SP

[daphenaxa]

No. We already know of your questionable taste when you went bonkers over Max's SP.

omg lol

 

[zschultz1986]

Maybe 'cos the choreographer in both programs is the same: Antonio Najarro

HAHA, well, that would do it.

 

[chairmanmao]

Wouldn't it be better for Jin to swap the 4Lz and 4T to get better GOE's and to prevent invalidating his 4T in case he pops it into a triple.
Something like:
4LZ
4T-3T

3A

 

[andromache]

Only watched the top 3, because after looking the protocols I was too sad because of Han and Misha.

Javier: I'm liking his (new?) facial hair. Pretty sexy. Heck, the whole program is sexy! He should get this choreographer to do both his programs next season. At first the arms were a bit much for me, but the movements are so purposeful and match the music, so I can't complain. Amazed he held onto that 4S landing without having to put a hand down. And if he keeps it together in the LP, it'll be a definite "HEY I'M HERE WORLD CHAMPION" to everyone ignoring him in the season of the Hanyu/Chan showdown.

Boyang: I don't follow juniors much, so this is my first time watching a full Boyang program. WHY is there a total lull in the music for the 4L-3T? Use the music to highlight the jumps! Anyway, the posts I've read on here had led me to believe that Boyang is basically garbage aside from his jumps...but that really isn't the case! I like his footwork, and his spins aren't half bad. He got level 4s on everything else, too! Which no one else did, except for Moris (whose jumps were much more flawed.) I'm impressed even with the lack of anything much else in between the jumps...which I'm sure will become much more apparent and annoying in the LP since it's longer. With his abilities, China should INVEST IN A GOOD CHOREOGRAPHER. Send him to someone! I agree with whoever suggested Philip Mills. I'm not sure if Orser is the answer. Or at least get him the EXPENSIVE Lori Nichol choreo. (By expensive, I mean whatever she gets paid to choreograph for Sui/Han...not whatever discounted choreo Han gets ). His LP should be exciting with the jump content, at least. But seriously...SO IMPRESSED that he lost no levels on spins or footwork.

Sergei: Love his footwork with the music and his tattoos. His spins make me cringe. There was a bit too much of a lull in the program before the footwork, but overall I enjoyed it.

 

[Ophelia]

no. We already know of your questionable taste when you went bonkers over max's sp.

shots fired.

 

[karne]

No. We already know of your questionable taste when you went bonkers over Max's SP.

Yawn.

 

[jagragold]

Javi has the perfect combination this year, I mean, he's a complete skater now. On the other side we have Jin Boyang, who only does jumps, jumps and more jumps.
I love when a skater has good jumps, good choreo, good skating skills... Jin doesn't have them (except jumps), so I pick Javi

 

[Sandpiper]

Javi: Loving the choreography, and how it carries through the entire program (the arms during spins, transitions into jumps, ect.) The best men's SP performance of the year, so far? (I'm not recalling any other standouts this year... by this point last year, at least we had Machida). Nice to see him fire a message to the Chanyu Wars: "Remember, I'm your reigning World Champion!" Now please Javi keep it up in the free... though perhaps not too much, since you need to save your best for GPF.

Boyang: :eeking: <-- Me, during his entire skate. Seriously, how does he do it?! And no, he's indeed not total garbage outside of the jumps. I mean, during Junior GPs last year, I found him seriously uncomfortable to watch outside of the jumps. But he's improved in terms of conviction and performance. If he doesn't land the jumps it's still not there, but he's gotten to a point where there's enough to supplement the jumps when they land. And TBH, I don't need him to become "an artist" (whatever that means). I just hope he finds programs that work better for him (meaning: not Tango Amore until he's older, and most definitely not Dragon Racing!).

I really hope his team is mindful of his development and health, because this kid is special.

Sergei: I like the skating and expression, though the music choice was a little... baffling.

Nan Song: I can't believe I'm saying this, but in terms of choreography, expression, and movement, he was the most enjoyable Chinese skater for me. I don't know if there's anything he can do to move up at this point, but it was nice seeing him get a solid placement in the SP.

Han Yan: I don't understand why Lori + his team would take this guy with strong SS, wonderful jumps, some innate musicality... and wear it all away with repetitive program after repetitive program. Especially when he was never suited for this type of program to begin with. It's verging on self-parody at this point...

Misha: Too many mistakes, but he did keep the performance going. Parts of the choreography were a bit ??? but there were other parts I enjoyed.

 

[TheGrandSophy]

Really enjoyed Javi's SP. Shows great charisma and a really committed performance.

Sad for Misha. I was hoping he could go clean. :sad21:

Boyang's jump bv is amazing. Really terrific achievement. They aren't as beautiful to watch though as Chan or Hanyu etc. And I was a bit surprised at the SS he was given. Maybe I am wrong- in fact I could be as I am not tech knowledgeable- but isn't he very shallow on his edges and even quite flat at times? So that number did seem high in comparison to some of the lower skaters there with less impressive jumps. Still- big achievement.

 

[[email protected]]

I enjoyed Javi a lot. Such a sensational SP. I know he would lose to clean Hanyu but I still like him more - Hanyu is too cold and distant for me. So happy to see Javi live at Rostelekom.

Last season Boyang looked just ridiculous. His team did a very good job to make him more presentable. His skating is still not top of the class and pcs he got is about right. But he has an unlimited potential with his jump content if keeps landing them.

I am glad for Sergey and he skates to my favorite Muse's song.

 

[Sydney Rose]

I'm in love with Javi's SP.
I watched it again and it was even more impressive than the first time. Just watch his arms
(don't kill me, but his interpretation is Takahashi level right now)

As the season progresses and Javi becomes more comfortable with it, I think it will become even more impressive.

Also wanted to say that all the comments about Boyang going to Orser for coaching make no sense to me. Brian already has two of the top male skaters in the world; why would he work with one of their competitors?

 

[Ophelia]

I said if one of Orsers boys leaves after 2018...

And Hanyu was/is Fernandez's competitor too. Doesn't deter the coaching situation.

 

[Ilvskating]

Can't agree more with this, especially for Nan Song and Han Yan. Han 's SPs has been such a waste of his talent. Chinese man in general are not good at comic goofy playful programs.

Love Nan Song's SP, so beautifully choreographed and skated. Hope he get's a nice LP too. He is also a super nice and sweet guy, not to mention how handsome he is I'm a sucker of graceful skating. Love powerful skating too, but it has to be with certain degree gracefulness to be enjoyable.

Javi: Loving the choreography, and how it carries through the entire program (the arms during spins, transitions into jumps, ect.) The best men's SP performance of the year, so far? (I'm not recalling any other standouts this year... by this point last year, at least we had Machida). Nice to see him fire a message to the Chanyu Wars: "Remember, I'm your reigning World Champion!" Now please Javi keep it up in the free... though perhaps not too much, since you need to save your best for GPF.

Boyang: :eeking: <-- Me, during his entire skate. Seriously, how does he do it?! And no, he's indeed not total garbage outside of the jumps. I mean, during Junior GPs last year, I found him seriously uncomfortable to watch outside of the jumps. But he's improved in terms of conviction and performance. If he doesn't land the jumps it's still not there, but he's gotten to a point where there's enough to supplement the jumps when they land. And TBH, I don't need him to become "an artist" (whatever that means). I just hope he finds programs that work better for him (meaning: not Tango Amore until he's older, and most definitely not Dragon Racing!).

I really hope his team is mindful of his development and health, because this kid is special.

Sergei: I like the skating and expression, though the music choice was a little... baffling.

Nan Song: I can't believe I'm saying this, but in terms of choreography, expression, and movement, he was the most enjoyable Chinese skater for me. I don't know if there's anything he can do to move up at this point, but it was nice seeing him get a solid placement in the SP.

Han Yan: I don't understand why Lori + his team would take this guy with strong SS, wonderful jumps, some innate musicality... and wear it all away with repetitive program after repetitive program. Especially when he was never suited for this type of program to begin with. It's verging on self-parody at this point...

Misha: Too many mistakes, but he did keep the performance going. Parts of the choreography were a bit ??? but there were other parts I enjoyed.

 

[rain]

Javi has the perfect combination this year, I mean, he's a complete skater now. On the other side we have Jin Boyang, who only does jumps, jumps and more jumps.
I love when a skater has good jumps, good choreo, good skating skills... Jin doesn't have them (except jumps), so I pick Javi

I love Javier's short program. Great choreography and presentation. Perfect for him.

I was really curious to see Jin Boyang, since I haven't before and he sure is an up and coming talent. He is a lot slower than the top male skaters at this point, and his spins are weak but he obviously has gorgeous jumps and beautiful naturally graceful arms. His weaknesses are strikingly similar to Nam's. It will be interesting to see how they both progress.

 

[aa456]

Love Javi's SP! One thing, though, it reminds me, ALOT, of the Lambiel "Poeta" Flamenco LP. (I get that it's similar because they're both Flamenco themed.)

OT but what a lovely program!

 

[mrrice]

I asked this question earlier and didn't get an answer. So, I'm going to ask it one more time. Hey guys, Who is Grant Hochstein? I swear if that guy had a mask on it could have been Ross Miner. Are they Coached or Choreographed by the same people? I can't believe how many skaters I don't recognize this year.

 

[purpledream]

FINALLY GOT THE PODIUM RIGHT (in the wrong order )!!! Thank you for not killing my predictions...yay for Boyang (4LZ!!!)! Those were HUGE scores!

Boyang was insanely good! Reminded me of when Yuzuru made a splash at his breakthrough season with his win at COC.

If he continues to be consistent, man such a huge threat to everyone at Worlds (and his fellow debutante Shoma!!! I really want Shoma to do well!!! )

 

[andromache]

I asked this question earlier and didn't get an answer. So, I'm going to ask it one more time. Hey guys, Who is Grant Hochstein? I swear if that guy had a mask on it could have been Ross Miner. Are they Coached or Choreographed by the same people? I can't believe how many skaters I don't recognize this year.

He finished somewhere in the lower-half of the top ten at Nationals last year.

After Googling him and looking at his wiki page, he finished 9th last year. Not coached by the same team as Ross, unsure about choreo. He was also on a TSL interview with Caroline Zhang; they're either close friends or dating, but I can't recall which.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Just finished a Jumpamatron for Jin Boyang. I liked his program and found all sorts of gems to mix in with his tech stuff. Based on the talk around here I'd say his presentation isn't tops of the field but under appreciated by many. He's really good:yes:

 

[Art&Sport]

My impressions based on watching the event after the fact, but in skate order so that I did not know outcomes ahead of time and could compare scores in real time with my own judgements:

I can't really argue with the overall placements, except Grant Hochstein was completely low-balled on PCS, unfairly! In fact, the PCS for many guys was simply WRONG. :furious:

Boyang Jin was fabulous technically. And it seems as if Nan Song has been inspired by his younger teammates to get his act together. Still, the PCS was out of whack for many guys. Javi Fernandez always gets high PCS whether he deserves it or not. In this case, I think Javi has made an excellent start to the season and is showing improvement and more confidence presentation-wise. But I sincerely hope he does NOT come out with the same bull crap cheesy fp that he had the last two seasons. I believe he is going to do something related to bull fighting, but I'll reserve judgment until I see it as to whether he's grown that much in presentation. He does have the goods to blow this field away overall, particularly as the defending World champion. Still, he should not get any positive GOE on the saved quad in the sp.

Boyang Jin has achieved something truly amazing technically and his program suits him, but let's be honest, he's a junior new on the scene and should not be having that many points thrown at him on TES or PCS. Why? Because he still has a long way to go development wise, and the message being sent is that he has arrived already. That's NOT a good message to send IMHO, because there is no real incentive to work on weak points as long as you can crank out quads till doomsday and amass an unrealistically high score your first time out on the senior GP.

A positive for Boyang is that he has thrown down the gauntlet in not only landing the most difficult jump with that freakin' extra revolution, he also did it in combination with a triple, so that's seven revolutions in split seconds. Unfortunately, the over-focus and over-scoring of quads means that split second revolutions are what this sport in the men's division has become all about. I don't foresee a good outcome unless the balance moves back to an emphasis on complete skating, and less emphasis on over-rewarding quads. Two quads in a sp is simply too much. Conversely, they don't allow quad twists in pairs short programs. Why is that?

Voronov's PCS are way too high; he does not have good lines or extension, and neither does he have good choreography and interpretation. He skated clean and landed his jumps, and so should be rewarded technically, but not artistically. Hochstein's and Martinez' PCS should be higher; Voronov, Balde, Song and Jin's PCS should be lower