2018 Olympic Figure Skating Team Event Day 3

[GGFan]

Not popular enough now to have a decent pairs or ice dance team, unfortunately.

It's not about winning, it's about sports culture. Compared to Russia, North America doesn't care as much about figure skating.... it has nothing to do with the IJS making skating "watchable", and everything to do with the fact that there is WAY less emphasis placed on interest compared to major league sports, except around the Olympics.

HOWEVER, I know a lot of Canadians (including co-workers who didn't even care about figure skating) who were glued to their sets yesterday and thrilled when the team won.

And a lot of them were astounded, having never watched much figure skating before -- especially some of the lifts in ice dance, the throws in pairs, and the jumps/spins in men's and ladies.

When did Canada and the U.S. become separate countries?

 

[beki]

Not popular enough now to have a decent pairs or ice dance team, unfortunately.

Muramoto/Reed are better than decent.

 

[enzofv]

I have been OK with the scoring so far EXCEPT for the UR calls. And that screws it all up in my opinion.

In fact the whole UR rule is bullcrap to me. An UR landed triple is still a landed triple. Non-hardcore fans usually don't even notice the difference anyway!! The penalties are too harsh and ALL the judges should decide together, watching the replays in slow-motion. This should be a no-brainer.

 

[readernick]

I was responding to the poster that said had a BV advantage over Mirai. She's doesn't.

What this means is Rika Kihira, who can and has landed multiple 3As has a massive BV advantage over skaters that can even backload. I suspect Eteri will push quads and 3As soon.

I hope Rika comes out next year and rules the world. If you want technical diffculty, it is there in spades and her programs are lovely too. Not only are her 3A lovely but her quads look close too. ( at least as close to what we have seen from Eteri’s students). As the previous poster mentioned, most of Eteri’s girls don’t even have good 2A but I don’t think that is true across the boards. A few might be able to get a 3A

 

[dorispulaski]

Play by play thread for the FD here
https://www.goldenskate.com/forum/showthread.php?69746-Team-Event-Free-Dance-Play-By-Play

 

[TCAngel18]

Adam's program did LOOK a lot better. Also, I think there is a lot of sentiment for Adam because he is an openly-gay athlete and his willingness to stand up to Mike Pence, etc.

I will say that Adam's been UR-ing random jumps this season -- he UR-ed the 3Z at the GPF SP and here and his 3F-3T combo at GPF FS. He also gives away points on spin/step levels too (he got level 3 here in the StSq). Those little things add up.

ETA: Though Patrick and Mikhail both had a level 3 spin. But Patrick hit both his quad. I do think Adam should have been 2nd, though I understand how the math works.

I think for Adam, the setup for the 3F/3T really matters, if his edge is off at ALL, he loses speed and he will UR. The 3Lz UR is definitely because of his shoulder injury. He is used to Rippon, or at the Least a Tano, so I think not being fully used to doing the 3Lz regular is throwing him off slightly.

 

[curious]

Patrick has been winning with messy skates for like 7 years now. All I can do is roll my eyes at this point

So right lol

 

[readernick]

Yes you have to be blind not to see her total lack of artistry. She has totally sacrificed the artistic part to land the triple axel reminds me of another much more talented skater than her mao. people should really stop their ridiculous insane jealousy directed at the two best skaters in the world. You won't change that fact no matter what you say. Mirai will be.lucky if she wins bronze and that's the truth.

I hate when people say that criticism = jealousy.That is not true. It is possible to like a skater, not feel jealous, and still see their weak points. Anyone with a trained eye will see them. All the ladies have weak points. If you can’t admit your favorite skater is not perfect it is you who have problems with emotional control not the person with the constructive criticism.

If your comment were true, it would mean you are jealous of Mirai. So, you are both criticizing another skater and at the same time condeming criticism. Major problems with your comment logically

I happen to agree with your criticism of Mirai. Also, agree what Alina’s PCS marks are too high given what she does artistically. I think Satoko is beautiful but has tiny jumps. Medvedeva is a great performer but I always wish she had a different choreographer and her jumps are muscled not effortless. Carolina is beauty itself but has consistency issues and ur. Katelyn is probably ( along with Alina) the most naturally talented skater but she needs to improve her mental game and her lp this year does not suit her. Criticism isn’t hate it is recognizing the good and bad of each skater hoping they will improve

 

[Feline Feeder]

I like Mira but she is not artistic.

The only thing that counts as "artistry" for the ladies is a slow, serious, delicate, uber feminine ballerina skate. (Ashley would be one exception, maybe Kaetlyn to an extent). The minute someone deviates from that, they are considered "juniorish." I imagine they lose PCS as well, though I haven't analyzed it. The men and dance teams have to do modern dance-like pieces or skate to whiny ballads. (Kolyada is the exception) Since the IJS, the routines have become more cookie-cutter. Someone like Elvis Stojko or Surya Bonaly wouldn't make it today.

Mirai's artistry was fine when she could get away with a cute routine. Now that she has to be an abandoned Vietnamese war bride, she seems kind of stiff. She probably can't express her real personality on the ice.

 

[GGFan]

The only thing that counts as "artistry" for the ladies is a slow, serious, delicate, uber feminine ballerina skate. (Ashley would be one exception, maybe Kaetlyn to an extent). The minute someone deviates from that, they are considered "juniorish." I imagine they lose PCS as well, though I haven't analyzed it. The men and dance teams have to do modern dance-like pieces or skate to whiny ballads. (Kolyada is the exception) Since the IJS, the routines have become more cookie-cutter. Someone like Elvis Stojko or Surya Bonaly wouldn't make it today.

Mirai's artistry was fine when she could get away with a cute routine. Now that she has to be an abandoned Vietnamese war bride, she seems kind of stiff. She probably can't express her real personality on the ice.

I do not think that's the case at all. GS is one of the places where I hear folks craving for something different all the time. I love the balletic influences but I love lots of other things as weill.

If you look at the favorite programs thread, I think Wakaba was the "winner." People like myself have been raving about her programs. I love her speed, packaging, big jumps, and the way she can handle big music.

Artistry can be achieved in many ways. I think Patrick does it with his commitment to his edges. Kaetlyn does it with her projection and presence. Satoko does it with her attention to detail. Jimmy Ma does it with his musicality. I see someone like Dmitri Aliev as a developing artist because he committed to his his music and his movement.

 

[curious]

Soooo by the end of this season, if they go to worlds and win, Tessa Virtue will be as decorated as Oksana Grishuk. Let that sink in for a minute

Not if the french team go.

 

[waltzonice]

. I have to wonder if US would have done the same if they had a realistic shot at the Gold Medal. Say if Nathan skated perfect in the short and wound up in first place. And if the Knierims had placed 2nd in the FS (which they could have if they skated clean with the quad twist). Would the US have put Nathan in for the FS to go for Gold in the team event? I'm thinking they would have.

ETA: I don't agree with the part about V/M's FD being too vulgar though. Not a fan of that "questionable" lift (even the updated version) but other than that, I thought it was fantastic.

 

[Nikidom]

I do not think at all, that Kaetlyn has been ever overscored.. There rather has been a purposeful- and subtle- war against Kaetlyn on this forum and on youtube from the few individuals of so- called " russian department".

I truly think that Kaetlyn is too overscored, even compare to Gaby clean FSs on national

 

[chopinskate]

The only thing that counts as "artistry" for the ladies is a slow, serious, delicate, uber feminine ballerina skate. (Ashley would be one exception, maybe Kaetlyn to an extent). The minute someone deviates from that, they are considered "juniorish." I imagine they lose PCS as well, though I haven't analyzed it. The men and dance teams have to do modern dance-like pieces or skate to whiny ballads. (Kolyada is the exception) Since the IJS, the routines have become more cookie-cutter. Someone like Elvis Stojko or Surya Bonaly wouldn't make it today.

Mirai's artistry was fine when she could get away with a cute routine. Now that she has to be an abandoned Vietnamese war bride, she seems kind of stiff. She probably can't express her real personality on the ice.

No.

 

[Nikidom]

The only thing that counts as "artistry" for the ladies is a slow, serious, delicate, uber feminine ballerina skate. (Ashley would be one exception, maybe Kaetlyn to an extent).

Lol you really think so? what about choreo, steps, sequences etc? do you think that "artistry" is moving nicely from one element to another on ice with wooden legs?

 

[Bcash]

Medvedeva brings a gorgeous , fragile , vulnerability to her skating. She draws you in from the outset and involves you in her World on the rink. She has a charisma that the younger girl does not yet , but since she's only 15 , that's maybe not a surprise.

I find Medvedeva unusual , I find her deeply memorable , and I think it will be a long time before I forget her.

She is certainly not bland as Zagitova, but she just can't jump properly. Muscling through them is not a beautiful sight.

 

[Ziotic]

I have been OK with the scoring so far EXCEPT for the UR calls. And that screws it all up in my opinion.

In fact the whole UR rule is bullcrap to me. An UR landed triple is still a landed triple. Non-hardcore fans usually don't even notice the difference anyway!! The penalties are too harsh and ALL the judges should decide together, watching the replays in slow-motion. This should be a no-brainer.

I disagree, having been a skater myself and always rotating my jumps it drove me insane when competitors would under rotate and get credit.

It was like why would I even bother going through all the trouble of working to rotate jumps when I could just do the spin on the ice??

 

[Elucidus]

I actually have to disagree with Ashley's comments and I usually hate backloaded programs. But I do not get bored at all with the program and the beginning keeps me interested. For me, it's as good as a backloaded program can be.

You didn't see Kostornaia's SP&FP, did you?

There's no way to make two minutes of non-jumping interesting...but it's still the most optimal strategy.

There is a way. See above.

 

[readernick]

I disagree, having been a skater myself and always rotating my jumps it drove me insane when competitors would under rotate and get credit.

It was like why would I even bother going through all the trouble of working to rotate jumps when I could just do the spin on the ice??

I don’t think he meant Urs shouldn’t be called. He means that they need to be called fairly and consistently. The tech panel only has access to one angle right now they should have multiple camera views and the calls need to be consistent across all skaters.

 

[Mathman]

She is certainly not bland as Zagitova, but she just can't jump properly. Muscling through them is not a beautiful sight.

Zagitova is the opposite of bland. She holds the viewer in rapt attention throughout. (Me, anyway).

Medvedeva's jumps are outstanding, except the double Axel. Wonderful technique.

Personally, I think that these two will be the 2018 Olympic gold and silver medalists despite our impassioned objections.

(But go Daleman! :yes: )