- Joined
- Feb 18, 2014
Omg that jumping ending
Julian is so good! So good!
I loved him right at the start of the season (qualifying for Olympics at Nebelhorn Trophy) and I love him now!!! GREAT THAT HE MADE IT HERE TOO!
Omg that jumping ending
Julian is so good! So good!
But out complaints have nothing to do with Nationalistic scoring but with their (judges) delusion that he deserves 9s in PCS category. "That seems definitive" is a very dismissive take on that, we just point out at clear problems with scoring when someone with empty skating and crossovers galore receives almost the same marks for that as someone like Patrick Chan or Yuzuru Hanyu ... Chen and Jin are clearly not held to the same standard as SP result highlighted (both tech calls and judging).While there seems to be a question in some contributors' minds regarding the PCS for this competition, there is a remarkable consistency among the actual judges of the competition.
In particular, the notion of nationalistic scoring bias doesn't hold up when the protocols are examined.
Nathan won the PCS for ever category when added across judges. Moreover, he was scored as the PCS winner by all individual judges when their total PCS scores are added. True, a judge or two may have scored another better at some single aspect of PCS, but not overall.
He won every category, and he won every judge. That seems definitive.
But out complaints have nothing to do with Nationalistic scoring but with their (judges) delusion that he deserves 9s in PCS category. "That seems definitive" is a very dismissive take on that, we just point out at clear problems with scoring when someone with empty skating and crossovers galore receives almost the same marks for that as someone like Patrick Chan or Yuzuru Hanyu ...
The fact that they scored him the highest in those categories is a by-product of him landing 6 quadruples after all these epic meltdowns in last FS etc, and them generally being nuts.
Nathan won the PCS for ever category when added across judges. Moreover, he was scored as the PCS winner by all individual judges when their total PCS scores are added. True, a judge or two may have scored another better at some single aspect of PCS, but not overall.
He won every category, and he won every judge. That seems definitive.
I mean, I understand the judges, really; Nathan was the only one skating well in that last group, they must have been ecstatic the World Champion wasn't an absolute mess and in fact wiped the floor with the competition by landing 6 quads, I'd probably have thrown a bonus somewhere too. But at some point this enthusiasm must meet some kind of actual reality of what the scores should entail and what the skater really does and earns.
If I look at the scores for Nathan's SS, I'm being told he has outstanding skating skills, on par with Patrick or Shoma's at the Olympics and only slightly below Javi's. They are different competitions with different judging panels, yes, but a 9-9.50 should still mean the same regardless of competition. And I apologise if this comes across as 'hating' on Nathan, it's not my intention, but I'm not quite sure I consider him a skater that has the quality for mid to high 9s in his skating skills. At least not with the programs he has produced and the way he has skated them, particularly his quad-heavy FS, unless SS equates being able to land all of your quads. Same for TR scoring. Because in the end, the stability he obtains in order to land all of his 6 quads is partly at the expense of this particular category.
While there seems to be a question in some contributors' minds regarding the PCS for this competition, there is a remarkable consistency among the actual judges of the competition. ...
4Lz, 4F, 4F+2T, 4T, 4T+2T, 4S.
Excuses again
In my opinion that is the problem, or at least a symptom of whatever the problem might be.
Did Nathan Chen really have better choreography than Kazuki Tomono?
Did he really have more transitions and of better quality than Misha Ge?
Yes, all nine judges said so with their marks. To me, this shows that the ISU judges are following some unwritten and unacknowledged scoring conventions that are not actually in the published rules about how these components should be scored.
Transitions, for example, can be counted and characterized fairly objectively. The skater either did a counter or he didn't. It is not the "opinion" of the judges. And yet, all the judges saw a lot of transitions in Nathan's program. (?)
Maybe to some extent it is easier to judge skaters in the same group relative to each other, than to compare Nathan to Misha who probably skated like an hour before him for the judges. I don't even know if they have the marks they already gave to everyone who skated before on their displays.
I guess in this dispute I'm going to side with all nine trained and qualified ISU judges, from all over the world, who scored the men's event, at least regarding this competition.
I just don't see the fight here. The artiest skater in the world just isn't that arty when half the program is spent sliding across the ice on his backside.
Well, that's kind of the point. The judges should not be comparing Nathan against Misha. They should be comparing Nathan to to the published judging criteria. Was Nathan's choreography a 9? Were Nathan's transitions a 9? (Variety, difficulty, intricacy, quality.)
Ge should be judged against the same the same criteria, independently of other skaters.
Maybe this is impossible. If so, then the ISU should stop pretending and go back to 6.0.
. I'm afraid Yuzuru won't be allowed to retire (one day) :shame:
Don’t know if someone already posted it but here’s the link to the press conference:
https://youtu.be/S3VCwmExAx0
I just love to see Kolyada so happy, he can hardly stop smiling
Dropped by to say, if some of these skates are getting 9's, would this get 11's? They don't do step sequences like 10 years ago, do they?
While there seems to be a question in some contributors' minds regarding the PCS for this competition, there is a remarkable consistency among the actual judges of the competition.
In particular, the notion of nationalistic scoring bias doesn't hold up when the protocols are examined.
Nathan won the PCS for ever category when added across judges. Moreover, he was scored as the PCS winner by all individual judges when their total PCS scores are added. True, a judge or two may have scored another better at some single aspect of PCS, but not overall.
He won every category, and he won every judge. That seems definitive.
In my opinion that is the problem, or at least a symptom of whatever the problem might be.
Did Nathan Chen really have better choreography than Kazuki Tomono?
Did he really have more transitions and of better quality than Misha Ge?
Yes, all nine judges said so with their marks. To me, this shows that the ISU judges are following some unwritten and unacknowledged scoring conventions that are not actually in the published rules about how these components should be scored.
Transitions, for example, can be counted and characterized fairly objectively. The skater either did a counter or he didn't. It is not the "opinion" of the judges. And yet, all the judges saw a lot of transitions in Nathan's program. (?)
Dropped by to say, if some of these skates are getting 9's, would this get 11's? They don't do step sequences like 10 years ago, do they?
Where's the time for them to do beautiful step sequences like in the past? I miss them, too, but honestly, these jumps require so much speed that beautiful step sequences are a fine art. One of the best ever is Michelle Kwan's in her 1996 flamenco short program -she's wearing the red dress with sleeves. Miss those!