2021-22 Russian Women's Figure Skating

[sclloyd]

This is why I always find it eyeroll worthy when I hear Kamila "Would Score 300+ in Men's" or whatever, as if men and women's scoring is exactly the same. A 15-17 year old man would not be getting 93.43 PCS in his Senior Grand Prix debut with a clean skate let alone with a mistake, even if he did 3 Quads. I mean look at Nathan Chen at the same competition: the 3-time World Champ (and OG fave) scored 92.78 in PCS and barely scraped 200 in the FS with 4 Quads!

Not trying to attack anyone here btw it's just I see this rhetoric all over the place when it doesn't work that way. This isn't because Kamila isn't extremely talented or anything, it just takes more time for Men's PCS to rise and the judges don't go crazy when rewarding GOE to a decent 4S.



Unfortunately for Aliona that is a best case scenario for her. I'm not expecting anything more than a silver, she hasn't even attempted 3*3As yet this season so I can't expect her to be fully clean on them in France. I hope she goes for all 3 this time, a silver is pretty guaranteed with a decent skate so might as well go in guns blazing. More than anything it's the PCS side that really needs to be worked on, she was always a PCS skater so seeing her not get 70+ in the FP is so disappointing, but definitely fixable.

Agree with basically everything here. Twilight ex from Aliona was much better than what we’ve seen from her so I’m hoping that when she finally settles into one program without switching AGAIN we see some of that sort of performance factor back. Maybe France will be enough to save herself and give her a little extra time.

As for Kamila, yes, GOEs very inflated, as are PCS. This is true of a lot of ladies but especially with her. Judges forget that her stellar spins for example, shouldn’t excuse how unappealing her jumps are, or how bad her jumping technique really is. I would give spins a bonus every time but I don’t think I’d ever give her jump combos higher than a 1, 2 if the axis and wobble is less noticeable. Trusova, with near flawless quad technique and much smoother landing almost always gets a lower GOE for those elements than Kamila does— see Skate Canada 2019 where Sasha’s 4T-3T, with a more interesting entrance and more speed + a falling leaf exit got the exact same number of points (16.82) as Kamila’s Skate Canada 4T-3T with standard entry/exit. If she is really as magnificent as everyone says, she will win without the point inflation, so I don’t understand why judges feel it’s necessary to give negative perceptions that come with being seen as “the favorite”.

 

[skatesofgold]

Agree with basically everything here. Twilight ex from Aliona was much better than what we’ve seen from her so I’m hoping that when she finally settles into one program without switching AGAIN we see some of that sort of performance factor back. Maybe France will be enough to save herself and give her a little extra time.

As for Kamila, yes, GOEs very inflated, as are PCS. This is true of a lot of ladies but especially with her. Judges forget that her stellar spins for example, shouldn’t excuse how unappealing her jumps are, or how bad her jumping technique really is. I would give spins a bonus every time but I don’t think I’d ever give her jump combos higher than a 1, 2 if the axis and wobble is less noticeable. Trusova, with near flawless quad technique and much smoother landing almost always gets a lower GOE for those elements than Kamila does— see Skate Canada 2019 where Sasha’s 4T-3T, with a more interesting entrance and more speed + a falling leaf exit got the exact same number of points (16.82) as Kamila’s Skate Canada 4T-3T with standard entry/exit. If she is really as magnificent as everyone says, she will win without the point inflation, so I don’t understand why judges feel it’s necessary to give negative perceptions that come with being seen as “the favorite”.

Kamila's jumps are so awkward.

 

[Mauvedreamer]

Liza is one of the most energetic performers out there today. There's a lot of fair criticism you can make about her and the scores she's been getting lately, but lack of energy isn't one of them IMO.

I was thinking exactly the same.

 

[lurkerghost1]

I wouldn't say her scores were higher, in fact her scores were significantly good only at SC events and only once she reached over 220 in but OK, she wasn't that much worse. Nevertheless, my points is Alina isn't competing not because she can't be competitive but because she simply doesn't want to compete no matter who the other skaters are.

Liza's scores 2018-19: 206 202 203 219 215 188 221 234
AVERAGE: 211.3
International Average: 209.9
International Average w/o WTT: 205.78

19-20 scores: 214 212 205 209 221 204
AVERAGE: 211.3
International Average: 212.6

Very interesting that she has the exact same average for both seasons.

You are right that Alina could be competitive but it's not only she doesn't want to compete, she would go into any competition as not the favorite for gold as we saw in 2019-20 GP which clearly took a toll on her/she didn't enjoy. Yes you're right she could have won disaster events such as Worlds 2021 but that doesn't mean she even would have got there in the first place.

And I still don't see how you've proved that Alina doesn't want to compete no matter who the other skaters are. If the 3A never surpassed her and she won GPF and Rusnats in 19-20 do you think she would have retired? I doubt it

 

[lopsilceci]

I think Alina took a break because she needed some relief after all the pressure from the previous 3 seasons and also because of having all the titles.

As to why she didn't come back later, partly I think it has to do with wanting to try different things outside of competitive skating (which is going super well) and also because she thought at the moment, like everyone else when 3A started dominating seniors, that she wouldn't be as competitive as she wanted to be and that another Olympics was out of question.

Later we saw that that's not necessarily true and a skater without big jumps can still be highly competitive, but back then everyone assumed that it was over for anyone without quads or triple axel.

Alina has expressed a few times in recent interviews that she does miss competing, so who knows? Maybe once this Olympic cycle is over, she will consider a comeback.

 

[Azikin]

As for Kamila, yes, GOEs very inflated, as are PCS. This is true of a lot of ladies but especially with her. Judges forget that her stellar spins for example, shouldn’t excuse how unappealing her jumps are, or how bad her jumping technique really is. I would give spins a bonus every time but I don’t think I’d ever give her jump combos higher than a 1, 2 if the axis and wobble is less noticeable. Trusova, with near flawless quad technique and much smoother landing almost always gets a lower GOE for those elements than Kamila does— see Skate Canada 2019 where Sasha’s 4T-3T, with a more interesting entrance and more speed + a falling leaf exit got the exact same number of points (16.82) as Kamila’s Skate Canada 4T-3T with standard entry/exit. If she is really as magnificent as everyone says, she will win without the point inflation, so I don’t understand why judges feel it’s necessary to give negative perceptions that come with being seen as “the favorite”.

15 year old girl who debuted as senior this season is accused for inflated scores and being judges favorite. Seriously? Or maybe she's getting such high scores because she's that good?

 

[eterialskating]

Agree with basically everything here. Twilight ex from Aliona was much better than what we’ve seen from her so I’m hoping that when she finally settles into one program without switching AGAIN we see some of that sort of performance factor back. Maybe France will be enough to save herself and give her a little extra time.

As for Kamila, yes, GOEs very inflated, as are PCS. This is true of a lot of ladies but especially with her. Judges forget that her stellar spins for example, shouldn’t excuse how unappealing her jumps are, or how bad her jumping technique really is. I would give spins a bonus every time but I don’t think I’d ever give her jump combos higher than a 1, 2 if the axis and wobble is less noticeable. Trusova, with near flawless quad technique and much smoother landing almost always gets a lower GOE for those elements than Kamila does— see Skate Canada 2019 where Sasha’s 4T-3T, with a more interesting entrance and more speed + a falling leaf exit got the exact same number of points (16.82) as Kamila’s Skate Canada 4T-3T with standard entry/exit. If she is really as magnificent as everyone says, she will win without the point inflation, so I don’t understand why judges feel it’s necessary to give negative perceptions that come with being seen as “the favorite”.

Stop undermining Kamila just because you don't like her. The men have been godfawful the past quad so it's not surprising there haven't many opportunities for judges to give top PCS scores and that even includes Hanyu. Chen is nowhere near Kamila or Anna performance wise so his scores will not have the same growth. I mean just look at the European men's and they are hopeless. It's been 2 years since Javi retired and no one has taken his mantle. They are terrible.

 

[Lzbee]

15 year old girl who debuted as senior this season is accused for inflated scores and being judges favorite. Seriously? Or maybe she's getting such high scores because she's that good?

Anyone can get inflated scores but Kamila is certainly the judges favourite. They've been waiting for her for 3 years. But she also does make their job easier.

 

[flanker]

The baggage is not in Moscow yet:

Багаж российских фигуристов, вернувшихся с Гран-при Канады, пока не доставлен в Москву

Багаж российских фигуристов, вернувшихся с Гран-при Канады в Ванкувере, пока не доставлен в Москву. Этап серии Гран-при в Канаде проходил с 28 по 31 октября.

m.sports.ru

Edit: Newer news says it was shipped to Moscow finally:

Проблема с багажом российских фигуристов - участников Гран-при в Канаде решена

Спортсмены вернулись на родину 2 ноября, однако багаж не был доставлен

tass.ru

 

[Greengemmonster]

What is with this random theory that Kamila is the chosen one?

So why did it happen? Did they go "eeny meeny miney moe" and land on her so they gave her all the marks and GOEs?

She's got the jumps, the spins, the skating skills and now the performance factor is steadily rising as well. To me she's the next development in skating. The one who has it all. Perhaps that's why they are rewarding her. Some people act as if she could go out there, barely eek out a 3-2 and she would still be getting the same marks. I'm sure they would shove her at the back of the pack if that were to happen (rightly so).

Veronika, Sofia Akateva (hehe I call her Sofia with the amazing posture in my head, seriously what is up with that posture and how do I get it???) and Sofia Samodelkina (Sofia with great emoting) are the next three skaters who I think "have it all" as well.

But Kamila is magic. So there's that. The magic factor.

 

[Arbitrary]

I don't understand this "accused of inflated scores" business. Did she bribe judges? ISU? IOC? Did RusFed bribe them on her behalf? Maybe Crystal Dome it was?
Total nonsense.

 

[MiraiFan]

15 year old girl who debuted as senior this season is accused for inflated scores and being judges favorite. Seriously? Or maybe she's getting such high scores because she's that good?

I think some of us are upset because some serious flaws are being ignored by the judges while other skaters are marked down for the same.

 

[gsk8]

 

[sclloyd]

I love how Kamila is a child too insensitive to handle criticisms but not a child when it comes to discussion about age limits. Anyways, I never blamed her for the judging. I even explicitly said “If she’s that magnificent she’ll win anyways, so I don’t know why judges give her the negative perception that comes with being ‘the favorite’”

It’s obvious she is the favorite. Pretending that the scoring doesn’t reflect that regardless of whether she’d win without favoritism or not is incredibly dishonest. Like calling a 10” fish 20” and saying that because the rest are 8” she’s a foot longer so she wins the award for size AND breaks the world record!! See how ridiculous it sounds?

 

[silveruskate]

Muravieva has a 3A and 4S now so she has it all too! Her career has been bubbling nicely I have to say. I'm so ecstatic because I was worried she might become an amazing performer that we wouldn't see enough of without the jumps. Not the case I'm pleased to say.

 

[silveruskate]

I love how Kamila is a child too insensitive to handle criticisms but not a child when it comes to discussion about age limits. Anyways, I never blamed her for the judging. I even explicitly said “If she’s that magnificent she’ll win anyways, so I don’t know why judges give her the negative perception that comes with being ‘the favorite’”

It’s obvious she is the favorite. Pretending that the scoring doesn’t reflect that regardless of whether she’d win without favoritism or not is incredibly dishonest. Like calling a 10” fish 20” and saying that because the rest are 8” she’s a foot longer so she wins the award for size AND breaks the world record!! See how ridiculous it sounds?

If we're talking completely objective without legacy then Kamila is right at the top-3 PCS even on the men's side. As far as quad heavy programs go hers is packed. The positions she can hold when performing (repeatedly) are just unattainable for 99.9% of the men, including Yuzuru/Nathan. They don't have the flexibility,. Even on the women's side no one has her flexibility and control.

Jumps - I agree with you. She HAS the jumps but is not a good jumper. Controversial, but hope people are charitable to the distinction.

 

[sclloyd]

I think some of us are upset because some serious flaws are being ignored by the judges while other skaters are marked down for the same.

YES. Thank you.

 

[Elana]

Muravieva has a 3A and 4S now so she has it all too! Her career has been bubbling nicely I have to say. I'm so ecstatic because I was worried she might become an amazing performer that we wouldn't see enough of without the jumps. Not the case I'm pleased to say.

I agree, she's a star! Such passion and emotion in every performance, she's such a joy to watch, it would be a shame for everyone to miss out on those qualities just because she doesn't have the jumps. Once she can stabilize the 3A and 4S in competition, I think she will be the complete package.

 

[Amei]

Twitter is saying Shcherbakova landed a 4F+3T at practice today in Italy

 

[lurkerghost1]

With Muravieva showing 3A and 4S the competition for Junior worlds only gets higher with 6 girls having serious chances and a near guarantee of a sweep. I don’t think it’s controversial to say that the current juniors are deeper than any of the previous cycles (Lipnitskaya-Radionova, Medvedeva-Sakhanovich, Zagitova-Tsurskaya, Trusova-Kostornaia-Shcherbakova, Valieva-Usacheva).