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- Apr 13, 2007
Does Kimmie need the triple Axel?
- Thread starter Mathman
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- Joined
- Jan 22, 2004
I personally like Kimmie even more for not being showy, not showing off "how pretty I am." She has very fresh, healthy charm, which I like a lot
ITA. Thats exactly what attracted me to her.
I personally like Kimmie even more for not being showy, not showing off "how pretty I am." She has very fresh, healthy charm, which I like a lot
She definitely is more subtle in that department, choosing not to wear loads of makeup and going for the more "natural" look. Definitely works on her, IMO
Good for her, I hope she doesn't turn to the dark side!
However- I just can't like her as a skater/on ice entertainer. Sure, I somewhat liked her freeskate this past season, but really, when you get past gimmicks, etc. there really is not much to her other than jumps...and even those she is beginning to slip up on.
Even that 14-year old kid at Nationals showed more personality than she did.
- Joined
- Jul 28, 2003
It's kind of like asking do all the men need the quad? As this season has proven the answer to that question is yes. I would think Kimmie (I hope she soon starts calling herself Kim) needs the triple axel. Mao Asada (sp?) can beat her hands down artistically, so in all likely hood the triple axle would give her an advantage. I imagine most of the female skaters are adding more difficulty to their jumps. The competition in the ladies is becoming as fierce as the men's. Will be an interesting season ahead...
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- Joined
- Mar 19, 2006
I think that depends on a few things. What "type" of personality are people looking for? Do people expect her to have a certain type of "personality?" Why doesn't the personality she does have, suit the general view?
Just some thoughts to expand on.
^ Are you referring to Kim? I'm assuming you are.
Although I've seen great improvement in this department on her part, she is still a rather bleh skater. IMHO, not quite as bleh as, let's say Miki Ando, but she definitely holds her own in the "bleh" department.
Although presentation (the old-timers may refer to it as "artistry") doesn't come naturally to everybody, I still think one can at least showcase a bit of personality in their skating. Kim doesn't have to suddenly morph into an emotional "Kwan" machine, but I would like for her to translate some of that "spunkiness" she shows off the ice into her skating. How? I'd say by picking a more uptempo song. Ballads or mellow pieces won't do it for her. IMO
To answer the last question Sean posed, I say the vast majority of people look to "identify" with the skater...to sort of "take a journey" with the skater that's on the ice. (That's what years of hanging out at MKF will do to ya
hwell: ) 
To many people, skaters like Kwan and Cohen do that. To others, watching one or the other (or both) makes watching fishing seem entertaining
Although I've seen great improvement in this department on her part, she is still a rather bleh skater. IMHO, not quite as bleh as, let's say Miki Ando, but she definitely holds her own in the "bleh" department.
Although presentation (the old-timers may refer to it as "artistry") doesn't come naturally to everybody, I still think one can at least showcase a bit of personality in their skating. Kim doesn't have to suddenly morph into an emotional "Kwan" machine, but I would like for her to translate some of that "spunkiness" she shows off the ice into her skating. How? I'd say by picking a more uptempo song. Ballads or mellow pieces won't do it for her. IMO
To answer the last question Sean posed, I say the vast majority of people look to "identify" with the skater...to sort of "take a journey" with the skater that's on the ice. (That's what years of hanging out at MKF will do to ya
hwell: ) To many people, skaters like Kwan and Cohen do that. To others, watching one or the other (or both) makes watching fishing seem entertaining
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- Jul 11, 2003
First and foremost, I do not like the use of the word Artistry except when discussing SOA.
Now Kimmie's presentation is her biggest drawback, however she is not the only one who seems bland to me. I don't want to open a can of worms here, but there are some very good jumpers in Ladies who do not have much of a presentation. I think all of these very young ladies will improve over the years.
This is just my opinion. I don't like cute, but it does show potential awaiting maturity.
Joe
Now Kimmie's presentation is her biggest drawback, however she is not the only one who seems bland to me. I don't want to open a can of worms here, but there are some very good jumpers in Ladies who do not have much of a presentation. I think all of these very young ladies will improve over the years.
This is just my opinion. I don't like cute, but it does show potential awaiting maturity.
Joe
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2006
Kimmie not Yu-Na, yes.
Thanks. Good answer.
Of course you don't
That's fine, the words "performance" and "choreography" say it in their definitions. if you are considering the end result.
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- Apr 13, 2007
I totally agree. I would love to see her skate to uptempo, happy music that underscores her freshness.
Kimmie certainly needs the 3 axel. She is not an ethereal "presenter", nor does she create an aura on the ice. I refer to her as a "paint-by-numbers" artist. In her approximately three years at the Senior level, she has gained a bit of artistry, but has lost security in the technical elements (jumps). With all of the talk (by Peggy, and sometimes Dick) that she is a "pressure" skater--somehow this has not been evident during this past season.
Why has this inconsistency occured. For one, she has grown upward and outward, physically, due to maturity. And most any physical growth in this day and age of advanced technical requirements can play havoc with a lady skater's technique. This probably accounts for the inconsistent 3/3's and a virtually disappearing 3 axel. If one holds that advanced technical elements are more easily accomplished and performed during the prepubscent years for ladies, whereas presentation develops through maturity, one can surmise as to why Kimmie and other 17-through-19-year-olds are caught in this conundrum. Kimmie and her peers were held out of senior competition through the imposed age requirement: At the ages of 15 and 16 they were at the height of the technical acheivements and lagging in the presentation. Whereas our last two USA Olympic gold medalists--Tara and Sarah--had been competing at the senior ranks at age 13 (and younger) during the height of their technical abilities and competing against (and absorbing) the mature artistries of Michelle et al. Sarah and Tara had to focus on developing a precocious artistry to even be competitive in the seniors. In fact, their Olympic titles were won at ages 15 & 16. Neither was a conummate artist (presenter, if you must) but both certainly had an on-ice personna and a developed (or innate) artistry to the extent that when combined with their technical feats, brought home the gold.
Take a quick look at Mao and Yu-Na at 2007 World's. We saw the effect of physical maturity on their jumping ability. (Even so, one must admit that they were phenomenal performing for the first time at this imposing event.) How will they fare in the technical department with another year (or another 3 years) of physical maturity?
Back to Kimmie. She IS a hard worker, a deteremined competitor. She is certainly not without talent. When she gains more confidence (and skills) in her presentation and communication on ice, I think that she might possibly regain confidence in her jumps. I hope so. She (and even Yu Na and Mao) must be looking over her shoulders at Caroline, Mirai et al. They will be hitting the Olympic year at about the ideal age for them--that is an age when they will still be at the top of their technical game. And we know that both have oodles of artistry (presentation) and charisma, already!
Why has this inconsistency occured. For one, she has grown upward and outward, physically, due to maturity. And most any physical growth in this day and age of advanced technical requirements can play havoc with a lady skater's technique. This probably accounts for the inconsistent 3/3's and a virtually disappearing 3 axel. If one holds that advanced technical elements are more easily accomplished and performed during the prepubscent years for ladies, whereas presentation develops through maturity, one can surmise as to why Kimmie and other 17-through-19-year-olds are caught in this conundrum. Kimmie and her peers were held out of senior competition through the imposed age requirement: At the ages of 15 and 16 they were at the height of the technical acheivements and lagging in the presentation. Whereas our last two USA Olympic gold medalists--Tara and Sarah--had been competing at the senior ranks at age 13 (and younger) during the height of their technical abilities and competing against (and absorbing) the mature artistries of Michelle et al. Sarah and Tara had to focus on developing a precocious artistry to even be competitive in the seniors. In fact, their Olympic titles were won at ages 15 & 16. Neither was a conummate artist (presenter, if you must) but both certainly had an on-ice personna and a developed (or innate) artistry to the extent that when combined with their technical feats, brought home the gold.
Take a quick look at Mao and Yu-Na at 2007 World's. We saw the effect of physical maturity on their jumping ability. (Even so, one must admit that they were phenomenal performing for the first time at this imposing event.) How will they fare in the technical department with another year (or another 3 years) of physical maturity?
Back to Kimmie. She IS a hard worker, a deteremined competitor. She is certainly not without talent. When she gains more confidence (and skills) in her presentation and communication on ice, I think that she might possibly regain confidence in her jumps. I hope so. She (and even Yu Na and Mao) must be looking over her shoulders at Caroline, Mirai et al. They will be hitting the Olympic year at about the ideal age for them--that is an age when they will still be at the top of their technical game. And we know that both have oodles of artistry (presentation) and charisma, already!
For what it's worth, I did see some 3axels landed by Meissner at a few Nationals practices in Spokane (I didn't see her landing tracings, but they looked pretty much rotated in real time).
IMO, Yu-Na pretty much defines whole package in this new generation.
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2006
Good point, let's hope that back of hers keeps healthy too.
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