I think Joannie is competitive myself.
Ladies LP
- Thread starter PolymerBob
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I think Joannie is competitive myself.
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- Oct 31, 2006
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Yeah, well, everyone thought Irina was going to be the invincible one in Torino, Michelle and Irina were going to be the invincible 2 in Salt Lake City, Michelle was going to be the invincible one in Nagano, and Midori was going to be the invincible one in Albertville. Sadly, none of them won Olympic gold. Most people I know who watch skating thought Kristi and Tara would take Olympic silver. Anything can happen under the immense spotlight and pressure of the Olympic Games. All of these top ladies should be regarded as competitive.
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- Joined
- Nov 24, 2007
Touché
But, wasn't Irina considered a strong favorite in Torino because Mao & YuNa weren't there due to their age?
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I agree. But I never got the whole Michelle/Irina is invincible. Michelle was hardly looking invincible that season quite frankly. As for Irina, Irina in 2006, well considering Irina's history should what happened in 2006 be really this big surprise. When Michelle handed Irina the gold medal on a silver platter in 2002, and I have no doubt the judges would have much preferred to annoint Irina than Hughes, Irina hardly responded with this great skate. And there were multipe times in her past when Irina was expected to win worlds and didn't due to errors. I thought that maybe this time Irina would pull it off because she as so calm at 2005 worlds. But looking back what happened is hardly really a surprise.
Michelle and Irina both lost two skaters who were always pretty calm under pressure. Arkawa's issues were more underrotation but she always came accross as calm and cool.
When it comes to Mao and Yu-na I think both girls actually handle pressure better than Joannie does... And the thing is if Joannie continues to skate well, the pressure is going to be on her too. I think it's possible for Mao and Yu-na to be beat, they aren't invincible. But that person will have to be perfect to do so as Miki was in 2007.
I'm not convinced that's Joannie.
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- Aug 15, 2003
I haven't yet seen Yuna skate clean at senior level if I remember correct.
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- Oct 31, 2006
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I totally agree!
She did at Cup of Russia last year.
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- Sep 30, 2006
A major weakness of Yuna is that she's easily injured, which I think is why Orser and Co. are undertraining her early in the season so that she can peak at Worlds. Her injuries is probably the reason why she hasn't skated many clean programs. Considering her textbook technique, she definitely has the potential to do clean programs. And when she's on, the only skater capable of overtaking her is Mao.
I really liked Joanie's program because it reminds of Jeff's programs - many transitions and very little telegraphing. From what I can tell, Joanie also has great jumping technique. I can't wait until Worlds to see how she fares...
I agree with your lineup here!
And I think that Joannie has better jumps, skating skills, steps, overall posture, stretch, and extension than Yukari and better skating skills, spins, spirals, steps, presentation skills, posture, stretch, and extension than Miki. But I guess she needs 3-3 to be competitive with a clean Miki and a clean Caro.
I missed all the ladies' LP action due to work, and I returned to find possibly the worst LP skate from Caroline in the last few seasons. She looked very tired and anxious to me, and trying to muscle out those jumps (especially the 3F) with that unnatural twist. The 3F take-off is definitely worse than last year. She's not only kicking higher, but also kicking out more to the side, which makes her scratch the toe on take-off, lean in the air, and then not have enough speed on landing to hold it. Her spins were slow, and she didn't skate with much energy in the second half.
She's only 15, too young to be as anxious and preoccupied with results as she seems to be. The trouble with being precocious... I thought maybe she will come out and nail the long, as she did with the LP at National's last year, after screwing up the SP. But now, I think the bad SP sapped her confidence even more. :no:
At this point, I think she should really go find a good technical coach before it's too late. Mingzhu Li trained only one elite skater before, Chen Lu, and Lulu had a lot of power and strength to her skating, which made jumps easier. I'm not sure that Li has the kind of experience or expertise to best help Caroline right now. Besides needing to focus on jump techniques, I think Caroline's training schedule is far too strenuous. Four hours a day on ice everyday (3 hours on Sunday), plus 1 hour physical training, plus running, plus other off-ice classes. Even for an elite athlete, that cannot be a healthy schedule for a 15-year-old girl! Mentally, she seemed a lot more free and confident back when she was going to school full-time and spending less time on the ice -- and she was skating better in competitions, too.
However, there are positives to take away from SC, too. She completed her first ratified 3S (with a 2T attached, no less) in a very long time. She also had no downgrades in either program, even for the falls, whereas last season she had downgrades of some kind at every competition. I also think that both of her programs have beautiful music and choreography that are well thought out, and that they would come out masterpieces if she could skate them to their full potential.
Hopefully Caroline will come out fighting at TEB with a fresh state of mind.
It's great that Joannie, Suguri, and Alissa all skated so well. Good job to the veterans! I'm happy that Carolina didn't get held up for once.
She looked very tired and anxious to me, and trying to muscle out those jumps (especially the 3F) with that unnatural twist. The 3F take-off is definitely worse than last year. She's not only kicking higher, but also kicking out more to the side, which makes her scratch the toe on take-off, lean in the air, and then not have enough speed on landing to hold it. Her spins were slow, and she didn't skate with much energy in the second half.She's only 15, too young to be as anxious and preoccupied with results as she seems to be. The trouble with being precocious... I thought maybe she will come out and nail the long, as she did with the LP at National's last year, after screwing up the SP. But now, I think the bad SP sapped her confidence even more. :no:
At this point, I think she should really go find a good technical coach before it's too late. Mingzhu Li trained only one elite skater before, Chen Lu, and Lulu had a lot of power and strength to her skating, which made jumps easier. I'm not sure that Li has the kind of experience or expertise to best help Caroline right now. Besides needing to focus on jump techniques, I think Caroline's training schedule is far too strenuous. Four hours a day on ice everyday (3 hours on Sunday), plus 1 hour physical training, plus running, plus other off-ice classes. Even for an elite athlete, that cannot be a healthy schedule for a 15-year-old girl! Mentally, she seemed a lot more free and confident back when she was going to school full-time and spending less time on the ice -- and she was skating better in competitions, too.
However, there are positives to take away from SC, too. She completed her first ratified 3S (with a 2T attached, no less) in a very long time. She also had no downgrades in either program, even for the falls, whereas last season she had downgrades of some kind at every competition. I also think that both of her programs have beautiful music and choreography that are well thought out, and that they would come out masterpieces if she could skate them to their full potential.
Hopefully Caroline will come out fighting at TEB with a fresh state of mind.It's great that Joannie, Suguri, and Alissa all skated so well. Good job to the veterans! I'm happy that Carolina didn't get held up for once.
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- Dec 5, 2004
Is there anyone else out there who thinks that Cynthia should try a new coach? I'd really like to see her back to her old form. Her skating is so beautiful and she deserves to be among the best skaters in the world. Any thoughts?
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- Sep 14, 2008
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Anything can happen but when making predictions, you ascertain what is most likely.
Joannie getting her 3-3 is a hope, not something to take into consideration when comparing these skaters at this very moment. Mao and Yu-Na are very far ahead of her technically and whether you agree or not, Mao and Yu-Na are favored in terms of presentation as well.
I personally don't think Joannie will ever get a consistent 3F-3T. She just isn't able to get enough snap off of her 3F landings. It would be wise to train the 3T-3T instead.
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2007
I just saw Rochette's performance on Youtube. I think it's beautiful. I'm not sure about comparing it with Mao and Yuna, but if she keeps this up consistently, her World rankings will definitely improve.
I felt this program was very much based on Michelle's 2003 one. Is it the same choreographer?
I felt this program was very much based on Michelle's 2003 one. Is it the same choreographer?
I think that Joannie can compete with Mao and Yu-na, and would love to see a nice three way battle.. BUT, I must say that if Rochette were to medal at Worlds this year the pressure on her would be incredible..
People keep on talking about how Mao and Yu-na are inconsistent and what have you. But you know what? I think that people forget the amount of pressure and expectations that have been placed on those two girls since the second they've stepped on to the Senior ranks. For the brief moment Mao got to be an underdog, she skated with much more abandonent (and her 3 axel was more consistent) Poor Yu-na went up the ranks soo quickly too...
And the thing is inspite of all of this both Mao and Yu-na have still managed to be the most consistent skaters in the field.
I think that both probably would have skated better in the earlier years if they had someone to chase. However, I think the upside for them both, is that they are both learning to handle and deal with the pressure now, and I think it will help them in Vancover.....Joannie would be faced with a whole new expectations than I think she's ever dealt with before. Apparently at the exhibition Manley went on and on about how she can pass the torch to Joannie and Olympic champion (yikes!)
I thought that was so unprofessional, especially in the presence of other very good female skaters, including two multiple world medalists. Of course Joannie beat all of them with a great margin, but rude nonetheless.
Joannie had faced such high expectations before. Remember at 2006 worlds in Canada, she was 1st after the qualifying round, and everybody was talking about her of getting a medal, and even a gold. She bombed badly in FP.
I do think she seems to be in the best conditioning we've ever seen though. I watched the exhibition, she was the only one who nailed every single jump which was frankly difficult due to the lightening.
We'll see whether she can keep the momentum going. I do believe she should forget about 3+3 in SP. There's no way she can still learn doing a 3+3 consistently in competitions at age of 22. If she performs well, and PCS keeps rising, she'll probably stay in 4th or 5th place after the SP, and there won't be a huge gap points wise either. She's always a good FP skater, and will likely close the gap and win a medal if skating clean.
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- Feb 17, 2007
I missed all the ladies' LP action due to work, and I returned to find possibly the worst LP skate from Caroline in the last few seasons.
As happy as I am for Fumie, Alissa and Joannie; I'm crushed for Caroline. I just don't get it. :scratch: If a bunch of amateurs on a message board can tell what Caroline's problems are, why can't her coaches and trainers? Don’t they get paid a lot of money to figure these things out? Don’t they watch her skate? Can’t they buy a $50 camcorder off eBay, record her practices, play them in slow motion and figure out what’s wrong? Has somebody at least told her she needs to skate faster?
I wish these people would get off their butts and do their jobs! :scowl:
OK, rant over now.
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