What's up with Morgan Matthews? | Page 3 | Golden Skate

What's up with Morgan Matthews?

backoutsideedge

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 28, 2004
If that were the case, then Skate Canada should be sending scouts to all the major US training centers, looking to recruit talented US ladies for Canada's Ladies and Pairs teams. They'd be foolish not to, if the USFS made it so easy to pirate skaters.

Is that what the US did with all their Russian skaters? Did they go to Moscow and St. Pete scouting for Peter T., Sur, etc.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Then what happens should Emily Samuelson or Evan Bates or Charlie White decide they'd rather skate for Canada? Should the USFS just say, sure, go ahead?
Sure. Goodbye and good luck.

It's like immigration policy. Who we let in, that's kind of tricky.

But if someone wants out, bon voyage.
 

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
No, those skaters left Russia with the hope to find a partner in the US. Back in those days when the Soviet Union was breaking up, skaters who weren't already the elite had no money, no coach, and no means to search for a partner in Russia. Ice conditions were terrible and rinks were closing.

They had to leave if they still wanted a career on the ice. The one exception was Barantsev, and it's just this year that Russia has finally released him.

Let's not forget that Canada has acquired a few Russians who were refused release (Markov, Golovkin).
 

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
How about this: what if Virtue or Moir had a career-ending injury. Would Canada be quick to release one of them if they found a partner in the US and wanted to skate here? I don't think so. What if Craig Buntin found a US partner who would only skate for the US? Would Canada release him?
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Tessa and Craig already live and skate in the U.S. (right down the street from me, in fact, LOL.) If they win a medal, what difference does it make if it the U.S. or Canada claims them?
 

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
Tessa and Craig already live and skate in the U.S. (right down the street from me, in fact, LOL.) If they win a medal, what difference does it make if it the U.S. or Canada claims them?

I think it would make a MAJOR difference to Skate Canada and Canadian fans if either of them were to skate for the US. Some Canadian fans are still grumbling about Tanith Belbin, who never skated internationally for Canada.
 

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
Is that what the US did with all their Russian skaters? Did they go to Moscow and St. Pete scouting for Peter T., Sur, etc.

In Gorsha's case didn't he leave Russia not for skating but for other reasons (following a coach is what I want to say?)

Petukhov came strictly for skating purposes (originally just to try out with Melissa, but he never used his return ticket :))


as for letting others just go in and out as they please. While skating is an individual sport the olympic elligible ultimately skate for a team - which just happens to be a country...

it's no different than a basketball player, hockey player, etc... like it or not you are on contract with them. Morgan got money from the USFSA for her skating - she's on the team. The USFSA should have some say as to whether or not one of their team members goes and joins a 'rival team'.
 
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chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
Except for Barantsev, all the other Russians who came here on their own were quickly released by Russia. The reason Barantsev wasn't released was he and his partner had won two JW championships in a row.

The RFSF didn't want to release him because they felt he was important to the future of ice dance, and the federation had already spent a lot of money on his training. I believe the USFS is refusing to release Morgan for the same reasons, and she has a similar array of medals and high international placements.

The USFS let Kaitlin Weaver go because there was no reason to hold her back. With Clavey, she had skated respectably well, but hadn't won any medals.

In this case, I don't think the USFS is as wrong as people seem to think.
 

hockeyfan228

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
How about this: what if Virtue or Moir had a career-ending injury. Would Canada be quick to release one of them if they found a partner in the US and wanted to skate here? I don't think so. What if Craig Buntin found a US partner who would only skate for the US? Would Canada release him?
What are Skate Canada's rules? Perhaps by their rules they are obligated to release them.

Since Craig Buntin wants to stay in to compete in Vancouver, it is likely that Buntin would say "bye-bye" to a partner who would only skate for the US, since it's rather late in the cycle for him to get US citizenship under the "extraordinary" rules, for which he probably wouldn't qualify.

Not that I'd think Buntin would want to represent the US at an Olympics in his home town and home country.

And who cares if the Canadians scouted US skaters? They'd have to convince skaters in a successful partnership to break it up, and if there were skaters who were unhappy in their partnerships, they should be fair game to make new partnerships that would make them happy.
 
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gsrossano

Final Flight
Joined
Nov 11, 2006
The USFS has the right to refuse release if the athlete has met any of these conditions in the past 4 years (2003-2004 to 2006-2007):

Actually that is not what the rule says. The rule says if any of the exceptions exist in the past four years, the Board gets to decide. The rule does not say what the criteria are for release or not. And that is one problem with the rule. It is totally arbitrary.

Plus...

It isn't even a rule (I can't find a rule number associated with it). It is a "policy." The policy implies that if a skater does not fall under one of the exceptions, release is automatic, but it doesn't say that explicitly. Nor does it say if the decision can be appealed within U.S. Figure skating (other to the Governing Council which can overturn anything the Board does). The requesting member can appeal to the ISU under ISU rules, but USFSA rules/policy says nothing about an appeal.
 
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discoduck

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 3, 2006
Re: Gorsha. According to Igor Sphilband, he and Gorsha defected together when they were on tour in the US in 1990. I think I have the year right. I just remember him saying it at a breakfast seminar I attended in Portland.
 

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
ooooooooo I remember you getting to go to that


but I didn't remember GORSHA being there...
 

discoduck

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 3, 2006
ooooooooo I remember you getting to go to that


but I didn't remember GORSHA being there...

He wasn't. Someone asked Igor how he came to the US and he told the story about Gorsha. :)

You know if Igor is involved, I'll find a way to get there. ;)
 

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
oh ok... I should have known that if I didn't remember you mentioning Gorsha that he wasn't there lol... because i would have been freaking out ;)

and yes I know - Igor is not safe if he's in your area, you will find him ;)
 

discoduck

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 3, 2006
:laugh: Actually Igor usually finds me but I'll admit that time I did go searching. I didn't, however, invite him to come sit directly behind us at the men's free skate.
 

Gregor

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 31, 2004
I can only speculate based on various discussions during GC. Some want her to sit out for more than the one year required by the ISU. Others hope that by not releasing her she will try one more time to find a US boy to skate with. But this is PURE SPECULATION. The reason for the decision was not released and never will be released.

I have just looked at this thread so I am sorry if this has already been said. First, did Morgan tryout with any USA guys? Second, if she has decided to skate with her Canadian partner, would not any second choice partnership with a USA guy be hurt by this controversy? How would Morgan feel? Would she be able to do her best if she was not able to skate with her first choice?

I want to see the USA win medals for many years in the future, so I would like to see Morgan and her partner skate for the USA. Why should not Canada be willing to release him? Why does Morgan want to skate for Canada when her success has been built with the USA?
 
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Gregor

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 31, 2004
I think it would make a MAJOR difference to Skate Canada and Canadian fans if either of them were to skate for the US. Some Canadian fans are still grumbling about Tanith Belbin, who never skated internationally for Canada.

Canada did not notice her or help her when Tanith could not find a partner there and came to the USA to find a partner. It is because she had not yet been successful. So why is Canada upset now that she has been successful in the USA?
 

SeaniBu

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 19, 2006
Country
United-States
Why should not Canada be willing to release him? Why does Morgan want to skate for Canada when her success has been built with the USA?
:agree: visa versa too. I wonder how much of the "success factor" plays - how successful so far is she really?. I think of Shani Davis and even Johnny W and wonder if there is such a thing as showing "props" for the federation, team, club that got you there anymore anyway. I would love to just see Morgan continue to skate no matter what flag she is wearing. But whatever her decision, I hope she gives her whole heart and doesn't skate for one and make it seem like she is skating for another country, or just selfish reasons. I doubt it, she seems to have admirable integrity. IMO she will pick her alliance and do them proud.
 
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