Figure skaters lend presence to North Korean event

[hurrah]

Nobody made a secret about her appearance in NK in Japan. Are you Japanese? If you are, you are the first J-person in my experience who is badmouthing about Yuko and her career choices. I could tell you more but I lost the interest.

I had no idea I was badmouthing Yuko. I think it's her life and she should do what she wants. It's just that I personally would not have the guts to be so unconventional and so I find her choices pretty wild.

 

[mousepotato]

I'm really curious how their new leader is going lead the country in the next few years. I have a feeling when South Korea got the Olympics for the second time that really hurt them, especially it being the winter games. They do have some talented skaters from what I saw in limited videos and I think they would really like to be a part of that, so he has to make major changes.

If current ISU skaters can convince them to make those changes, I don't see how that can be bad; like someone said, they aren't going to change the regime for the worse by skating there. Yuko Kavaguti has a degree in international relations so maybe skating there will help her career if she ever would like to go back.

I’m sure there was a time when no one thought the Olympics would be held in China or American baseball players would be playing MLB games in Cuba, but times change and it has to start somewhere.

In regards to Laura, with as much time as she has been off, I’m sure people haven’t been beating down her door to perform so she probably saw it as one more opportunity to have people see how good she really is. Not everyone gets to do "Art on Ice."

I had no idea I was badmouthing Yuko. I think it's her life and she should do what she wants. It's just that I personally would not have the guts to be so unconventional and so I find her choices pretty wild.

May I ask what is "unconventional/wild" about Yuko? Except maybe her sp hairsyle?

 

[hurrah]

May I ask what is "unconventional/wild" about Yuko? Except maybe her sp hairsyle?

When a single Japanese woman decides to move to Russia on her own, that's unconventional and wild.

(It's not like saying, 'Oh, I'll study abroad in United States for a couple of years'. The level of cultural gap between Japan and Russia and the obstacles one would have to face to get accepted would be on a totally different level.)

 

[mousepotato]

When a single Japanese woman decides to move to Russia on her own, that's unconventional and wild.

I'm sure she's not the first and she moved to New Jersey with Moskvina not Russia; she didn't move to Russia until years later. Many skaters have to leave home it's not really unconventional.

Have you read Trankov's story when he was 16? And he just moved from Perm to Saint Petersburg

 

[hurrah]

I'm sure she's not the first and she moved to New Jersey with Moskvina not Russia; she didn't move to Russia until years later. Many skaters have to leave home it's not really unconventional.

Have you read Trankov's story when he was 16? And he just moved from Perm to Saint Petersburg

If you put her in a pool of skaters who have done more or less the same, sure that's the norm. But if you compare her to most Japanese women, she's wild. I'd say most top-level skaters (actually, all top athletes) aren't concerned with what's conventional. Rather, they wanna be unconventional.

 

[mousepotato]

If you put her in a pool of skaters who have done more or less the same, sure that's the norm. But if you compare her to most Japanese women, she's wild. I'd say most top-level skaters (actually, all top athletes) aren't concerned with what's conventional. Rather, they wanna be unconventional.

Judging by how my kids from Japan I register for University each semester I think they are wilder than you give them all credit for.

BTW Narumri Takahashi moved to Canada to train when she was 15. Crazy kids!

 

[Ilvskating]

I find this whole drama a bit contradictory. How come people from democratic countries react so strongly about someone else doing what they chose to do, knowing or not knowing the circumstance. Isn't that violation of the precious freedom or human right that we are all against?

 

[Krislite]

I find this whole drama a bit contradictory. How come people from democratic coutries react so strong about someone else doing what they chose to do, knowing or not knowing the circumstance. Isn't that violation of the precious freedom or human right that we are all against?

You're confusing law and morality. Nobody is calling for these skaters to be punished by the law. Nobody is saying they have no *right* to be there. And we have every right to express disgust, justified or not, at their participation in this event.

If someone says to you "you shouldn't do X" when "X" is a human right, doesn't necessarily mean they're saying "you should be jailed for doing X". Learn the difference. One is merely expressing a moral judgement (itself a right), whereas the other is a call for violating a right.

 

[antmanb]

Just to clarify the reason I called it a witch hunt is because every year the media singles out one skater and puts them through the ringer for it (rightly or wrongly is obviously your own choice to make) when in reality it is a show with several skaters taking part, but all but the one selected for the lambasting are let off the hook.

I can't decide how I feel about skaters taking part in this show, but do think it's unfair for one skater to bear the brunt of the criticism, especially when a lot of elite skaters have done this.

 

[ivy]

The article referenced at the beginning of the thread singles her out because it's a Finnish newspaper, so of course it talks about a Finnish skater. I haven't seen (though maybe there are) other articles singling out Lepisto, except those from Finnish papers.

I suppose you could label gsk8, and the posters here, as the 'media'. But I just don't see the witch hunt at all...

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

I am as anti-communist as anyone on this board. ( I still refer to China as a communist dictatorship. ) But really, has starvation in North Korea gotten worse since Laura skated there?

How is this relevant?

 

[CoyoteChris]

I must say I have to thank you all, especially Olympia and Mathman, for a most interesting discussion. I am one who is into the moral delema. Should Mirai go skate for the head of Syria's birthday?
Should Racheal go to China, where things can become interesting for female babies, and the pollution is so bad it effects the west coast of the US? And yet, the US buys tons of rare earth metal batteries
from China to power its cellphones so that little girls can text misc brain droppings to each other while driving their "environmentally friendly " Priuses which also have batteries that have polluted the Chineese environment.
Who is the good guy and who is the bad guy? I think it is a personal decision. If you dont like Stalin killing millions of Russians, then dont go skate for him. Its your choice. I am an American and will be till the day I die but I hate my government and what it is doing to its own people and others around the world. Black and white have be come grey for me.

As an aside, some of you young folk might want to do a search on Google for "Ping Pong diplomacy". Who knows what the future will bring because of skating in NK?

Chris without sin who casts many stones

 

[mskater93]

IP: Basically, PB is saying that it's not Lepisto's fault there are issues in North Korea, so why should she bear the brunt of criticism

 

[R.D.]

There is a point in the above. The world has now become WAY too intertwined for such nitpickings.

 

[seniorita]

I think World Peace is a concern of Miss Universe. Skaters are not Unesco ambassadors, they are athletes. Shows is part of their job. It is not the case in other sports, only in fs we look so much their choices outside the arena.
I m not happy with how a big part of people in South Africa live but I didnt see why Mundial shouldnt be held there.

 

[ivy]

I think World Peace is a concern of Miss Universe. Skaters are not Unesco ambassadors, they are athletes. It is not the case in other sports, only in fs we look so much their choices outside the arena.

Well really in this instance they are entertainers, not athletes. There is no competition, just a show. If some how NK got an ISU sponsored event I think the conversation would be different (maybe they do in speed skating?). Sports and entertainment don't exist in a bubble, they are enmeshed in the rest of this messy, confusing world. These concerns come up all over the place (Go Joey Cheek!)

 

[Olympia]

There is a point in the above. The world has now become WAY too intertwined for such nitpickings.

In a way, it's precisely because it's become so intertwined that the issues are worth our contemplation and discussion. A century ago, it was easy to be oblivious to some tyranny on another continent. Not our problem what "those heathens over there" were doing. Now, if the wind blows cold in one country, the people in another country sneeze.

If there were one right answer to the problem of engaging isolated dictatorships in the rest of the world, life would be a lot easier. But Chris is right: ping pong diplomacy did lead to engagement with China. What will skating lead to in North Korea? Or is it not time yet to share the goodies of world culture with them?

One thing comes to my mind: during the time when Eastern European countries were overthrowing the Soviet-sponsored governments, one of the countries (for some reason I recall that it was Lithuania) had massive demonstrations in the capital city. I remember looking at a news photo of one gathering and realizing with somewhat of a jolt that many of the signs were in English. Think about that for a second: English is not the national language of Lithuania. Whose attention were they trying to attract? Clearly people in several of the countries of the outside world. They knew we were out here.

I think that there are several paths for people to take when trying to improve the lot of people in a repressive country. (I'm talking about private citizens and non-government groups. Most of us don't set government policy.) Some people choose to boycott, while others choose the opposite path and opt for engagement. The most basic thing to do is convey, somehow, the idea that we hear you; we know that you're there. At this moment, it seems next to impossible to communicate this to the general public in North Korea. But who knows? Maybe word does get through. If any people over there are listening, shouldn't they know that we're out here?

 

[dorispulaski]

I have unapproved a number of posts for being too political. If any of you want to continue the political discussion, pm me and I will move the unapproved posts to Politics forum.

 

[CoyoteChris]

Shoot! I am having another senior moment. Wasnt there a worlds or Olympics where some nations were thinking of pulling due to political reasons?
I think the politics should be separated from the issue of the decision of the skaters. For instance, today our Sec of State Ms. Clinton said Russia and China had blood on
their hands, supporting Syria and sending them weapons. Should our skaters boycott Sochi? I think not. I dont think the ISU nor the Russian nor Chineese skaters want
to see blood in Syria. I like to think of the skating community as having the moral high ground over politics and war. If an individual skater has an issue, then they must act their conscience.
Having said all of that, I still like Olympia's original post and Mathman's too.

 

[DianaSelene]

For instance, today our Sec of State Ms. Clinton said Russia and China had blood on their hands.

Well, look who's talking.