2015 Russian Nationals Mens FS

[HanDomi]

He popped quad sal in GPF

 

[robinhood]

I am sorry but I don't think it's only aesthetics in Kovtun's jumps...I noticed he has very little flow coming out of his jumps, and while the get good height in video (which can be deceiving, I know) he doesn't get much distance. Now, I don't know the mechanichs of jumping technique but I can notice these things.
The thing he does with his torso is unique, indeed and I don't remember other skaters doing it. It's as he prepares for the next jump before leaving the ice
And aesthetics in a subjective and "artistic" sport matter and a lot, imho

 

[HanDomi]

I am sorry but I don't think it's only aesthetics in Kovtun's jumps...I noticed he has very little flow coming out of his jumps, and while the get good height in video (which can be deceiving, I know) he doesn't get much distance. Now, I don't know the mechanichs of jumping technique but I can notice these things.
The thing he does with his torso is unique, indeed and I don't remember other skaters doing it. It's as he prepares for the next jump before leaving the ice
And aesthetics in a subjective and "artistic" sport matter and a lot, imho

I think no flow out of jumps is case for most of russian skaters, it's the same school for all of them basically. They jump more straight to the air and drop like a stone on ice - it's my feeling

 

[Meoima]

Me watching Kovtun is like: hey what is that music accidentally playing in the background?

In short Kovtun can skate to anything IMO and he still looks the same.

 

[robinhood]

I think no flow out of jumps is case for most of russian skaters, it's the same school for all of them basically. They jump more straight to the air and drop like a stone on ice - it's my feeling

Liza has great flow on her landings...Voronov and Pitkeev (specially last year, when he was junior) have much better flow than Kovtun- Voronov gets huge distance in his quad and 3A, although he telegraphs it a lot

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

I remember Chris saying that Gachinsky had landed everything in practice (at SA) - so, if that is the case, it must be some kind of mental block?

He popped quad sal in GPF

Ah right, forgot about the GPF.

Still landed the 4S in the SP (and essentially the 4T in both).

12/16 quads and people call him inconsistent?

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

I remember Chris saying that Gachinsky had landed everything in practice (at

Me watching Kovtun is like: hey what is that music accidentally playing in the background?

In short Kovtun can skate to anything IMO and he still looks the same.

Agreed lol... That's like every Russian man, except maybe Menshov who is the most interesting to me.

 

[Sandpiper]

Sure, add Chan's 3A to that. Bad technique but he's landed it with more consistency than other guys with suppose good axel technique.

Really? Chan was more inconsistent on his axels than any top skater except for Lambiel--who just happened to have even worse technique than Chan.

I don't really have an opinion on whether Kovtun's jumps are poor technique or poor aesthetics, but as Stojko said in his TSL interview, figure skating is all between the ears. Someone can have good technique but still fail to land their jumps because they just don't have the competitive nerve (see: Gachinski, or for a female example, Kostner).

I think no flow out of jumps is case for most of russian skaters, it's the same school for all of them basically. They jump more straight to the air and drop like a stone on ice - it's my feeling

Say what you want about skaters like Voronov/Menshov/Gachinski (or champions like Urmanov/Kulik/Yagudin/Plushenko before them)... but I've never heard anyone complain about them having ugly jumps. This must be the first time I've heard of anyone lumping them in with Kovtun...

 

[adelia]

I think no flow out of jumps is case for most of russian skaters, it's the same school for all of them basically. They jump more straight to the air and drop like a stone on ice - it's my feeling

Yeah, see this is the reason why I really don't like it that Rus Fed is trying to make Kovtun the face of Russian skating. People use him as a negative example to stereotype Russian skaters.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

I remember Chris saying that Gachinsky had landed everything in practice (at SA) - so, if that is the case, it must be some kind of mental block?

Really? Chan was more inconsistent on his axels than any top skater except for Lambiel--who just happened to have even worse technique than Chan.

I don't really have an opinion on whether Kovtun's jumps are poor technique or poor aesthetics, but as Stojko said in his TSL interview, figure skating is all between the ears. Someone can have good technique but still fail to land their jumps because they just don't have the competitive nerve (see: Gachinski, or for a female example, Kostner).


Say what you want about skaters like Voronov/Menshov/Gachinski (or champions like Urmanov/Kulik/Yagudin/Plushenko before them)... but I've never heard anyone complain about them having ugly jumps. This must be the first time I've heard of anyone lumping them in with Kovtun...

I don't think they're ugly but they are up and down. Kovtun's quads are more like a spring to generate height hence the hunch, whereas Hanyu and Chan and Fernandez go up and across the ice.

I agree that Russian men are known more for up and down jumps than across the ice. You don't see a ton of flow but the jumps are still big and most definitely rotated.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

I remember Chris saying that Gachinsky had landed everything in practice (at SA) - so, if that is the case, it must be some kind of mental block?

Yeah, see this is the reason why I really don't like it that Rus Fed is trying to make Kovtun the face of Russian skating. People use him as a negative example to stereotype Russian skaters.

Attitude wise he's a bad example but artistically I prefer him to many other Russians. As a representative of the Russian team he's immature as a person/ambassador, but he's quite consistent, and internationally Russia's best chance at a medal until Voronov decides to add a 4S or improve his artistry or telegraph his jumps less (I do quite like Voronov's spins wayyy more than Kovtun though).

 

[adelia]

Attitude wise he's a bad example but artistically I prefer him to many other Russians. As a representative of the Russian team he's immature as a person/ambassador, but he's quite consistent, and internationally Russia's best chance at a medal until Voronov decides to add a 4S or improve his artistry or telegraph his jumps less (I do quite like Voronov's spins wayyy more than Kovtun though).

Pray tell me the last time Kovtun had 2 consecutive clean skates?

 

[Sandpiper]

Attitude wise he's a bad example but artistically I prefer him to many other Russians. As a representative of the Russian team he's immature as a person/ambassador, but he's quite consistent, and internationally Russia's best chance at a medal until Voronov decides to add a 4S or improve his artistry or telegraph his jumps less (I do quite like Voronov's spins wayyy more than Kovtun though).

I can't speak for anyone else, but Kovtun's attitude isn't what bothers me. It's his performances (no attempt to connect to the music or the audience, choreography could've been about anything, constant deer-in-highlights expression, not very lovely jumps... though I give him credit for improving on these aspects, in the FS here, with the exception of the jumps). He just doesn't seem like he could ever weave any magical moments for me. Voronov, Menshov, Gachinski, and even young Petrov at least seem aware of what they're skating to, and make an effort to perform their programs. (Well, in the case of Artur, he did. Verdict is out on whether he could get it back).

Not saying you can't prefer Kovtun artistically, of course. Just responding to the idea--implied by at least two people, not just by your post--that people only dislike him because of his attitude.

 

[satine]

I can't speak for anyone else, but Kovtun's attitude isn't what bothers me. It's his performances (no attempt to connect to the music or the audience, choreography could've been about anything, constant deer-in-highlights expression, not very lovely jumps... though I give him credit for improving on these aspects, in the FS here, with the exception of the jumps). He just doesn't seem like he could ever weave any magical moments for me. Voronov, Menshov, Gachinski, and even young Petrov at least seem aware of what they're skating to, and make an effort to perform their programs. (Well, in the case of Artur, he did. Verdict is out on whether he could get it back).

Not saying you can't prefer Kovtun artistically, of course. Just responding to the idea--implied by at least two people, not just by your post--that people only dislike him because of his attitude.

I really wish he would work on his facial expression. I'd instantly like his performance more :thumbsup:

 

[volk]

Maxim still has not established himself as a team leader. I guess we'll have to wait for next year. But isn't it the year Plushenko's coming back?:think:

 

[invisiblespiral]

....what?

 

[Gia_Sesshoumaru]

Maxim still has not established himself as a team leader. I guess we'll have to wait for next year. But isn't it the year Plushenko's coming back?:think:

Not officially no, though yes, he has said that he's not ruling out the 2018 Olympics. He is competing in the Medal Winners Open next month, though.

 

[Sandpiper]

Maxim still has not established himself as a team leader. I guess we'll have to wait for next year. But isn't it the year Plushenko's coming back?:think:

Plushenko expressed in several recent interviews that he does not miss competition at the moment. He's unlikely to be back next season.

 

[volk]

Plushenko expressed in several recent interviews that he does not miss competition at the moment. He's unlikely to be back next season.

http://www.sports.ru/others/figure-skating/1025341960.html

Here he says he'll come back in 2 years if his health allows him. He wants to 1st to skate five Olympics and get a medal.

 

[LRK]

From a very recent interview, originially posted by plushyfan here:

http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/sh...ni-Plushenko&p=1059798&viewfull=1#post1059798

"This season I definitely miss. It took nine months, and I still back to the end will not be adjusted - there is still a slight inflammation. When this is all over and formed, when I will not feel pain, we will think about the future. But, to be honest, while I was at competition not miss. I thought that with the arrival in Sochi something will change, but no. I must get bored, it is too early, "- said Plushenko told reporters.


So, whoever dreads his return, should pray that he keeps busy and happy, and doesn't get bored...