2016-17 GPF Ladies SP

[Meoima]

I think a WR in TES is also problematic because the GOEs are just as subjective. There are bullets that must be accounted for, but they're almost never applied correctly. The system isn't broken, it's the judges.

I think it's also important to note that world records in figure skating aren't actually acknowledged under the ISU: they're called season's best and they don't carry over after the season ends. This list is used to give skaters their Grand Prix assignments and were previously used to determine start order at competitions. Worlds records are just something that the fans have come up with.

Yeah, after Sochi, the scores have gone wild so sometimes I don't get why people hung up on the word WR that much. The issue is the PCS has a ceiling, even GOE only has 3 as maximum and now judges are running out of these scores. So it creates some illusion that getting huge scores is so much easy now, yes it's easier than before but...some skaters never get benefits while others get too much.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Not sure why anyone should care about a WR score....it's pretty much the tech panel's world record anyway

 

[4everchan]

i never cared about WR in figure skating.... some judges are more generous than others... some tech panels too... why worry about it? Sometimes, someone performs really really well... and they hit a number.... no need for drama... it doesn't remove anything from the previous best SP score. Elements change. PCS have been rising since year 1 they were introduced.... Technical content (in men at least) has been rising too... some rules changed and will change... BV for jumps or GOE allowance have changed... we are comparing green apples to yellow and red ones (i wouldn't go as far as saying oranges and apples)... Also, isn't GPF traditionally the highest international scoring event of the year??? (or is that Europeans???)

 

[nolangoh]

Oh my god, don't give him any ideas! He might be reading this at some point! Besides, he just covered that theme with that holocaust tribute that went viral last week...

Other ridiculous themes that I wouldn't put past Averbukh:
- a tribute to Columbine, Sandy Hook and Virginia Tech
- the OJ Simpson trial
- the Waco siege
- the 1972 Munich Olympic massacre
- the Manson family murders

... crap, now I'm the one giving him ideas.

You know what, if he dares, he could do a Korean War Tribute since the Olympics will be at Korea. And he does not even have to change the choreography that much, just change the music or the sound effect and thats it. 9.5 PCS.

 

[4everchan]

you mean med would skate to that in korea? omg.... you are

You know what, if he dares, he could do a Korean War Tribute since the Olympics will be at Korea. And he does not even have to change the choreography that much, just change the music or the sound effect and thats it. 9.5 PCS.

 

[sabinfire]

Aren't you afraid that some people might suggest that it's Ilya phoning in the choreography :ddevil:

I'm only afraid for the other competitors, a real-time feed from a world-class choreographer would be an unfair advantage for Evgenia!

 

[MIM]

Satoko:

Light as a feather.

Yes, her face and body movements all look so light and feathery. I recall that when Yuna was asked about her choreography "lark ascending", her answer was that it was very challenging to move your arms all the time cause you are supposed to be a bird. I appreciate Satoko's sensible and considerate approach to the choreography and her ability to execute as she desires.

Well TAT says she was practically ideal. She said you can like her or not, etc, but she did it very precisely.

Yep, she would be a Choreographer's dream

Satoko's peogram is so pretty.

I cannot think of anyone who can skate like her. And program suits her like a glove.

Her 3T was not as clean as anyone wants, but it is hard to call underrotated. I re-watched slow-mo like 10 times. I think it was on the borderline in the worst case.


Katelyn:

It truly does not get better than Katelyn Osmond when she's on. So dynamic, fluid, flirty, and fun! Amazing performance!

:thumbsup:

TAT loves, loves her. Musical, artistic, very with the music. Excellent program. Wanted to know who did this program for her because I think she is pretty much saying with this, she started loving her. She didn't think she was bad, but she wasn't like this. Grishin also loves her very much this season.

Who would not love her after that performance?

Her comeback this year is just mind blowing. Her FS is still in the making (hope we can see better version tomorrow though) Her Coach Ravi Walia deserves a nobel prize of skating. He supported her hard days, stabilized her wild huge jumps including the massive 3F3T, and found a brilliant choreographer for Katelyn. He had a vision for Katelyn even in the early days; her programs were extremely difficult and packed with transitions. Does he coach other skaters, too?

Maria:
Maria had a visually tight landings on 2A, but her 3F was on the borderline in the worst case. Anyways her 3Lz in the combo jump is so high and covers so much ice. Her presentation has improved since the NHK. I think she is channeling Pogo a little bit. Fierce and strong style of skating suits the tone of the music. I think she is breaking out of a shell. Her dress is beautiful resembling the butterfly, the music she is skating to.

Anna:

Coach Anna is going to smack Anna around for that wobble.

Pogo has been through alot. I am glad she's gotten stronger and there is other person in the KnC she can rely on.

I just LOVE watching Anna now, she has become such an incredibly dynamic performer, you really can't take your eyes off her. It's hard to believe her evolution, t's such a pleasure and privilege to be able to see her become this.

:agree:

I was worried when she stumbled, I thought it was going to be a disaster. She is down on TES, so I am expecting 3rd.....

She was almost tripped on the ice. I was worried if she pulled a muscle in the back. The crowd cheered for her and she kept her cool, putting a smile on her face, waiting for the music to start gracefully. IMO, she felt the pain on her first spin after 3Lz3T combo. She did not let others see her weakness during the performance. But something was not right with her; She turned out of a 3lo; a 2A was clean but did not have the usual Pogo power. She hold a haircut position long and somewhat determined to change it to Biellman position. I don't know. I can be over sensitive... I hope she is in a better condition tomorrow. What she did after that shaky incident was admirable. I think the impact were only minimal and she copped very very well. She thanked to the crowed as leaving the ice.

Elena

Lol if I can count on anyone to land their jumps with nothing but sheer will, its Radio.

LOL. Yes she has a super human will power. She is selling the program on the stsq. But has her SS been regressed? It looked rough around edges...

Evgenia

TAT really liked Osmond today. She got most compliments out of anyone not named Medvedeva.

I am curious what does TAT compliment about Medvedeva? Does she mention her choreography, or her skating skills?

I just can't with all the whining Medvedeva haters here. Hate her or not, she is just that good than anyone else currently competing and scores simply reflect that. Osmond has great jumps, and that step sequence is impressive. She is powerful skater and in theory she should beat Medvedeva. But Medvedeva just games the system better than anyone currently by picking up those GOEs and extra points left and right, which of course results in irritated anti-fans complaining about backloading (+GOE, check), arm above hands jumps (+GOE, check), slow speed (non stop transitions = higher PCS, check).

This should be the sane mindset to understand the results.

I tried very hard to understand judge's PCS and GOEs. But I think I missed a memo when it comes to how they judged Evgenia compared to Katelyn. Would it change their mind if they saw E and K skate back to back?
I just enjoy reading posters trailblazing their career in choreography. I see lots of potential here. The ideas are unlimited!!

 

[Mango]

Lance Vipond is Kaetlyn's SP choreographer. He also does choreo for Keegan Messing.

 

[4everchan]

^^ i think they have seen K and E in skate Canada... maybe not back to back but they know... Medvedeva knows how to max out her BV despite using lower value jumps than Kaetlyn... Kaetlyn only backloads the 2A... Evgenia backloads all 3 passes... that goes a long way... I think TES is perhaps fine... where I have a bit more of an issue in on PCS but then, i am not judge so let them decide

 

[4everchan]

:agree:he's so good!

Lance Vipond is Kaetlyn's SP choreographer. He also does choreo for Keegan Messing.

 

[Jaana]

I think this was a really enjoyable sp-event!!! Such great performances from everyone... About the World records, in my opinion that has very little meaning in the big picture. Scores change from various events and today they are a lot higher than some years ago.

 

[nolangoh]

you mean med would skate to that in korea? omg.... you are

obviously it will be regarded as *art* because anything choreographed by Averbukh must be *artful* otherwise we are "uneducated" :dev3:

 

[da96103]

They should come to Düsseldorf. Third largest japanese community in Europe after London and Paris.

I have been to Dusseldorf. My brother studied in a town nearby called Duisberg. So I flew over there and met him. Then I went back to the hotel room and switch on the TV and saw Shizuka Arakawa won her Olympic gold medal in 2006. Have been a fan since. If German TV had not shown the Olympic live telecast, I would not be here.

 

[gravy]

Yeah, after Sochi, the scores have gone wild so sometimes I don't get why people hung up on the word WR that much. The issue is the PCS has a ceiling, even GOE only has 3 as maximum and now judges are running out of these scores. So it creates some illusion that getting huge scores is so much easy now, yes it's easier than before but...some skaters never get benefits while others get too much.

I think it was more so after Hanyu's well deserved sky high scores at NHK and the GPF last year. It seems that many judges got the impression that it's OK to mark up skaters like crazy if they skate clean and to continuously reward them higher scores if they're consistent. Because they do this, they're forced to award "lower" scores that are still ridiculously high when mistakes are made (I believe Medvedeva won Europeans with a fall and got a 143).

It's frustrating because these whacky scores are happening across all disciplines; for example, Hubbell & Donohue's total score that landed them in 6th place in Boston would have won the World title in 2014 (even though the maximum TES of the short dance was lower last season than during the Sochi season!).

I know that at the end of the day, ranking is the most important thing. However if the scoring isn't accurate in the first place, there will come a time when someone wins because their scoring range for a clean program was so high that mistakes weren't enough to push them down to a position that reflected what was actually put on the ice that day.

 

[da96103]

Oh my god, don't give him any ideas! He might be reading this at some point! Besides, he just covered that theme with that holocaust tribute that went viral last week...

Other ridiculous themes that I wouldn't put past Averbukh:
- a tribute to Columbine, Sandy Hook and Virginia Tech
- the OJ Simpson trial
- the Waco siege
- the 1972 Munich Olympic massacre
- the Manson family murders

... crap, now I'm the one giving him ideas.

Don't forget Jonestown, Guyana.

 

[Meoima]

I think it was more so after Hanyu's well deserved sky high scores at NHK and the GPF last year. It seems that many judges got the impression that it's OK to mark up skaters like crazy if they skate clean and to continuously reward them higher scores if they're consistent. Because they do this, they're forced to award "lower" scores that are still ridiculously high when mistakes are made (I believe Medvedeva won Europeans with a fall and got a 143).

It's frustrating because these whacky scores are happening across all disciplines; for example, Hubbell & Donohue's total score that landed them in 6th place in Boston would have won the World title in 2014 (even though the maximum TES of the short dance was lower last season than during the Sochi season!).

I know that at the end of the day, ranking is the most important thing. However if the scoring isn't accurate in the first place, there will come a time when someone wins because their scoring range for a clean program was so high that mistakes weren't enough to push them down to a position that reflected what was actually put on the ice that day.

And the issue is the system still use rankings based on scores doesn't it? Now everyone get 9-10 and +3. It's not much different from 6.0
And I don't understand why judges think that and do that and ISU don't do anything. They certainly should have known that creating new scale values cost more than adjustments in the judging inflation? And yet why are they throwing out scores like crazy?

 

[nolangoh]

TAT really liked Osmond today. She got most compliments out of anyone not named Medvedeva.

I just can't with all the whining Medvedeva haters here. Hate her or not, she is just that good than anyone else currently competing and scores simply reflect that. Osmond has great jumps, and that step sequence is impressive. She is powerful skater and in theory she should beat Medvedeva. But Medvedeva just games the system better than anyone currently by picking up those GOEs and extra points left and right, which of course results in irritated anti-fans complaining about backloading (+GOE, check), arm above hands jumps (+GOE, check), slow speed (non stop transitions = higher PCS, check).

10% bonus in the second half true. but there is a +GOE guidelines where one needs to fulfill a few bullet points in order to get a certain amount of final GOE. Arm above the head is only ONE feature, that alone does NOT credit for a +3 GOE. If the judges are not following the guidelines anymore, then this system is just broken. All rules will be useless

 

[da96103]

Or how about this, tell the story through the skating and not by putting in mimed "effects" like taking a selfie. I don't consider this highbrow at all, but Dancing-with-the-Stars level cheese.

Polina Edmonds told the same story in her much-maligned Gone With the Wind program, and I think she actually told it better. At least she did it through her skating, and not with theatrical tricks.

1 year had passed and the most hated ladies' program of 2015/2016 is suddenly not so bad? Well time certainly makes people forget

 

[MaiKatze]

Say what you want but Evgenia's team just know how to milk the system. It's exactly what they do with all of their skaters. Milk the system as much as possible. And while it is not the most exciting way, it's understandable and why change it if it works? Why improve when you're getting gold either way? Why think outside the box when others don't follow, challenge you on your own strengths and do the same?

 

[Osmond4gold]

^^ i think they have seen K and E in skate Canada... maybe not back to back but they know... Medvedeva knows how to max out her BV despite using lower value jumps than Kaetlyn... Kaetlyn only backloads the 2A... Evgenia backloads all 3 passes... that goes a long way... I think TES is perhaps fine... where I have a bit more of an issue in on PCS but then, i am not judge so let them decide

Agreed, ...I watched Eurosport UK, and they were questioning Kaetlyn's PCS scores. They both felt they should have been higher relative to her TEC score and the previous skater.