2017 GP Skate Canada Ladies FS

[Eclair]

I think judging in the past seasons have made us believe that UR are not important and PCS are given like candies.

This 'harsh' judging just seemed so harsh, because we are used to very very lenient judging.
But if the tech controller had judged this hard in 2010 or 2005 nobody would have blinked an eye.

 

[beki]

I think Kaetlyn's LP is fine, but her short program makes me feel she might be the best skater in the world. Seems like a missed opportunity to find a program that really sings for her. The edge goes to Med for changing hers.

 

[leafygreens]

Mariah 188.56

Ashley 183.94

Mirai 178.25

Karen 170.40

Plus Mirai outscored Karen at U.S. Classic. (Karen's FS then was Carmen.)

I meant to put Courtney where I put Karen but my post has been removed because I dare defend Courtney. The ranking is Mariah, Ashley, Courtney, Mirai, Karen across GP. The point being, no, Ashley's bronze should not be a guarantee of anything because it's the points that should matter, not the medals. And US Classic is not in the selection criteria, is it? Mariah has the highest score so far, as shocking as that is to some people.

 

[kresslia]

Missed the last bit... oh god, Anna, what happened here?

That score and PCS is just... disastrous.

I don't know how the Russian Fed can trust her for the Olympics with two bombs in a row (Worlds - SC)

 

[Shayuki]

I think judging in the past seasons have made us believe that UR are not important and PCS are given like candies.

This 'harsh' judging just seemed so harsh, because we are used to very very lenient judging.
But if the tech controller had judged this hard in 2010 or 2005 nobody would have blinked an eye.

I hope they do keep this up. Many skaters have been able to get away with URs.

And while I certainly am not a fan of Osmond's skating overall, she definitely is a good jumper and doesn't UR. That unfortunately is very rare these days... Perhaps a consequence of such lenient judging allowing it to happen.

 

[twirlingblades]

Ashley has had 5 concussions not just one

I'm really surprised she had a doctor's green light to skate after 5.

(Idk how many of these she went to a doctor for or how bad they were. I don't claim to know her medical history, but usually 3 or 4 is the cut off for a lot of sports).

 

[ice coverage]

I meant to put Courtney where I put Karen but my post has been removed because I dare defend Courtney. The ranking is Mariah, Ashley, Courtney, Mirai, Karen across GP. ...

Thanks for explaining your intention re putting Courtney on your list.

So the GP scores for the five U.S. ladies thus far are:

Mariah 188.56

Ashley 183.94

Courtney 182.57

Mirai 178.25

Karen 170.40​

... And US Classic is not in the selection criteria, is it? ...

2017 Challenger comps would be among Tier 3 selection criteria -- if(?) the Olympic selection criteria are modeled after the 2017 Worlds criteria.

2017 GPs (but not GPF) would be among Tier 2 selection criteria.

2017 GPF would be among Tier 1 selection criteria.

 

[temadd]

I don't understand the people who think Ashley was overscored here. She won by PCS over the others. When her underrotations get ignored or she is given generous technical scores I feel that way as well. But she is one of the best performers out there and it reflects to her scores even when other parts of her skating are somewhat lacking. That is how the scoring works and how it should be in my opinion.

Besides some people are comparing her with herself in Boston. She won the World Silver there, of course today's performence is not as good as that. But it's not like she has lost all her skating skills and performance ability and started from the bottom. She deserves her PCS.

That being said, I am still shocked that she got herself to the podium. She is a total survivor and I admire her for that.

And without performers like Ashley I would not watch figure skating at all. Figure skating needs audiences to survive. Some of the performances today were completely lacking in soul, connection to the music and connection to the audience. If they all performed like Kaetlyn did today I would stop watching. I hope that Katelyn is able bring that music to life next time.

And I hope that Marin Honda can get the PCS scores that she deserved today. She has excellent skating skills and connection to the music and performed. She was robbed.

 

[TerpsichoreFS]

Do we still have a chance to see Marin at the gpf? It seems to be the only way her pcs would increase enough for potential Olympics

And I like Kaetlyn's black swan... sometimes I feel people judge a skater based on their own prejudice on said skater and not on what is being put on the ice.

 

[MaiKatze]

Do we still have a chance to see Marin at the gpf? It seems to be the only way her pcs would increase enough for potential Olympics

And I like Kaetlyn's black swan... sometimes I feel people judge a skater based on their own prejudice on said skater and not on what is being put on the ice.

She has to win Cup of China. And with that being next week, coupled with Alina Zagitova, Mai Mihara and Wakaba Higuchi as competition, it's almost impossible.

Edit: Ah, no, I saw she's 5th not 4th. So, it's impossible anyway.

 

[gravy]

Couldn't watch Marin live so I just saw her program. Wow... she was hosed here. The fact that her free skate earned 10 points lower than Osmond's error-filled performance is a joke.

Way to kill off a formidable contender, Skate Canada. :thumbsup: I already see many who were (justifiably) trashing Rostelecom's homecooking now defending this mess as if it's any different. Judging in this portion of the competition was just as much of a joke as it was last week. :sarcasm:

And I say this as someone who defended Kaetlyn's short program score yesterday amongst what I thought were very unfair criticisms. This score as well as the underscoring and wrong technical calls of others, however, are pure shenanigans.

 

[yoloaxel]

Finally caught up with the second half of the competition and - wow

-Sad for Marin after such a nice FS, but she really did kill her chances in the SP, I don't think the judging towards her was that unfair. Maybe a couple more points in PCS.
-I'm absolutely GUTTED for Anna. She's clearly not in her top physical shape and some of those falls were just downright scary. I think with the Russian field this year, her chances of getting that Olympic spot are so slim I feel so bad for her and I hope she can find a way to get back to her top shape
-Kaetlyn should have won imo, but her FS score was definitely too high. She's good, but that program just wasn't.
-I don't mind Ashley's PCS. She is one of the best performers out there imo!
-Karen really needs to do something for all those underrotations and she needs to do it fast
-Maria Sotskova is probably going to get that 3rd spot. She's improved but I still find her boring and I loathe her angular tano arm.

What a mess of a competition though, especially compared to the clean skates at CoR!

 

[temadd]

-Maria Sotskova is probably going to get that 3rd spot. She's improved but I still find her boring and I loathe her angular tano arm.

I agree! She probably figures that if she does the same bent, awkward tano arm as Evgenia she may get outrageously high scores too.

 

[Spirals for Miles]

Maria is definitely making a case for earning that 3rd spot... but Polina might as well!

 

[volk]

Amazing score for Osmond. Canadian bonus in full force!

 

[Blades of Passion]

But if the tech controller had judged this hard in 2010 or 2005 nobody would have blinked an eye.

That's not true at all. Between 2007-2010 the tech panels DID throw many < calls around and it was really horrendous because at that point in time a < call meant the same as a << call. Many times people did not agree with the calls in the first place and competition results were constantly being drastically influenced, with audiences left bewildered, giving them yet another reason to turn away from the sport. There were huge, constant outcries and it resulted in two different levels of underrotation calls being put in place, the < and << we have now.

The tech panel here did not judge "hard", they judged WRONG. 5 underrotation calls for Rika Hongo is so absolutely absurd, especially on the first two jumps they called. I would have only called her 3Loop, the rest were right there within the limit and were not given the benefit of the doubt. Karen Chen's Lutz should not have been called and her Flip appears exactly 1/4 short when looking closely, so that too should not have been called, especially since she pre-rotates it less than other skaters when considering "benefit of doubt"! Marin Honda's 3Toe combo was also not more than 1/4 short. Maria Sotskova's Lutz should not have been called either, that was so random.

 

[yoloaxel]

I agree! She probably figures that if she does the same bent, awkward tano arm as Evgenia she may get outrageously high scores too.

Except their arms look completely different:
Evgenia: https://ibb.co/bFOiam
Maria: https://ibb.co/c13S1R

 

[temadd]

Except their arms look completely different:
Evgenia: https://ibb.co/bFOiam
Maria: https://ibb.co/c13S1R

You are showing Maria from the front and Evgenia from the back/side. Regardless both are awkward to me

 

[karne]

Some thoughts on the ladies' event now that I've had another couple hours' sleep:

- Of the two Swans at the end I want to see Anna's more. It had more feeling, more fire, much bigger potential to me. Kaetlyn's was...bland.

- Sotskova was very nice. No sparkle or x-factor for me but still two very nice skates. She also should have got a standing ovation, especially when you consider that the audience stood for Ashley.

- Speaking of; Ashley's performance felt very phoned-in to me. The program also seemed emptier than usual, and that was a big part of why I felt she got a big PCS gift.

- I'm still pissed that Chartrand's PCS was higher than Kailani's and no, the fact that Kailani still finished ahead does NOT justify it.

- I was reserving my thoughts about Honda's scores because she went first but now, after the conclusion of the event, I think she was underscored in the PCS department. She wasn't on fire or anything, but she was a damn sight better than almost all of the other ladies out there tonight.

 

[pearly]

Finally caught up with the second half of the competition and - wow

-Sad for Marin after such a nice FS, but she really did kill her chances in the SP, I don't think the judging towards her was that unfair. Maybe a couple more points in PCS.
-I'm absolutely GUTTED for Anna. She's clearly not in her top physical shape and some of those falls were just downright scary. I think with the Russian field this year, her chances of getting that Olympic spot are so slim I feel so bad for her and I hope she can find a way to get back to her top shape
-Kaetlyn should have won imo, but her FS score was definitely too high. She's good, but that program just wasn't.
-I don't mind Ashley's PCS. She is one of the best performers out there imo!
-Karen really needs to do something for all those underrotations and she needs to do it fast
-Maria Sotskova is probably going to get that 3rd spot. She's improved but I still find her boring and I loathe her angular tano arm.

What a mess of a competition though, especially compared to the clean skates at CoR!

I agree with most of your post. The judging was fine and so is the final order. Marin didn't do herself any favors in the SP yesterday, but had absolutely nothing to lose today and did great. 10th to 3rd is a big deal. The fact she is not on the podium is IJS and math, nothing else. The judges today had her in 3rd and the panel had her in 1st (BV). She was probably hurt a little by the fact she skated in the first group - and first in the group no less. Just goes to confirm - "you cannot win a competition in the short program, but you sure can lose it".

Kaetlyn and Ashley's PCS are fine. People keep forgetting that elements which form PCS simply do not translate thorough screens and it is a whole different thing when you see it live in the arena. To me Sotskova's score if awfully close to Ashley's, but I know better than to go on a rant about it. I wasn't there.

Kaetlyn, Ashley and Carolina have that certain something that comes with age and that the younger skaters like Mihara, Medvedeva or Honda (all of whom I like very much) do not have yet. They will, in a few years.

However I am not the least gutted for Anna. Honestly I'd be at peace if she - at any point in the past or future - did what Gracie did and openly stated she was dealing with personal things (it doesn't even have to be depression or anything specific). Then I'd probably salute her for still trying and competing. But without that all I see is a brat who treats a competition like a practice. I even think she should get deductions for excess in interruption considering how long it takes her to get up and continue skating. Everybody falls, but when you fall in competition you pick yourself up and you finish your skate. You do NOT skate around in a circle for five seconds. You do not slowly fix your glove. You do not stop and ponder what to do next. That is poor sportsmanship. You get up and finish your program because there's an arena full of people who came to see you skate.

I'm also not buying the "she does everything with maximum speed and height so her falls hurt more". So do Yuzuru and Kaetlyn, to name just two. You don't see them sulking after each fall. This wasn't a one time thing, this is now typical Pogorilaya behavior. The world doesn't owe you competition spots, clean skates and perfect scores all the time. You need to learn how to deal with it. I wouldn't be surprised if the Russian fed replaced her with another skater for Skate America.