2023-24 Japanese Nationals - Men's SP

[KiraraChin]

It's so sad because I thought we were finally past the point of Kazuki being held back in PCS
He's so appreciated and adored by fans worldwide for his ability to perform and entertain but receiving 7s and low 8s for PR
And like you said, it's not as if he's popping or falling all over the ice, this is for skates where he jumps decently well

BTW, I hope everything is good with you

Same, I naively thought Kazuki was finally getting the respect he deserves, but this season he's back to being paid in dust Even though his skating, composition and overall packaging are better than never, his efforts are not recognised.

Apart from being furious with JSF's clowning I'm OK thanks! Hope you're well too, and thank you again for your hard work updating these Japanese national threads, much appreciated

 

[figureskatingandrainbows]

To be fair, Kao's spins need Jesus and Shun's edge on his flip is... not good, he's gotten calls on it pretty much every time he's done it, but I do feel like sometimes the top 2 are given the benefit of the doubt where others are not. Fortunately, that wasn't an issue today, I don't think Shoma/Yuma had anything ignored, but it is also a little sad to see great skaters get stingy scores.

 

[deedee1]

Oh c'mon, tech panel. Why can't Shun break 90 with that clean skate?! And Kao's spins? We all know he isn't the best spinner but 2 spins almost invalid??? I'm no expert of course, but have a say to judges on KAzuki's PCS. And Fuji TV... delayed broadcast on Group 4 & 5 thruout,, ALL12 skaters...

 

[yuumagical]

And Fuji TV... delayed broadcast on Group 4 & 5 thruout,, ALL12 skaters...

The delayed broadcast was super annoying...Decided to go to sleep before they showed Koshiro... At least I'm glad they showed everyone, unlike certain broadcasters who cut skaters for the sake of time...

 

[tsuyoboogie]

Men's SP video
Videos are not high quality but can be increased up to 720p by clicking on the settings gear
All performances were taken from the FOD livestream (no commentary)
I did experience some streaming issues (glitching, freezing and jumping ahead...as well as the stream just dying )
I went back and recaptured programs that I remembered were interrupted by said issues however,
I haven't checked each video thoroughly so some may still be affected
Please let me know if there are any problems with the links or video listed below

Warmup Group 1
1. Sena Takahashi - 2023 Jr Nat’l 8th
2. Sakura Odagaki
3. Seigo Tauchi - 2023 Jr Nat’l 6th
4. Daiya Ebihara - 2023 Jr Nat’l 7th
5. Tsudoi Suto - 2023 Jr Nat’l 3rd
6. Taiga Nishino - 2023 Jr Nat’l 5th

Warmup Group 2
7. Shunsuke Nakamura - 2023 Jr Nat’l Champion
8. Kazuki Kushida
9. Takumi Sugiyama
10. Kazuki Hasegawa
11. Minato Shiga
12. Yuto Kishina

Warmup Group 3
13. Lucas Tsuyoshi Honda
14. Haru Kakiuchi - 2023 Jr Nat’l 4th
15. Haruya Sasaki
16. Keisuke Kadowaki
17. Ryota Kitamura
18. Rio Nakata - 2023 Jr Nat’l 2nd

Warmup Group 4
19. Koshiro Shimada
20. Tatsuya Tsuboi
21. Sota Yamamoto
22. Kao Miura
23. Shun Sato
24. Sena Miyake

Warmup Group 5
25. Kosho Oshima
26. Kazuki Tomono
27. Takeru Amine Kataise
28. Yuma Kagiyama
29. Shoma Uno
30. Nozomu Yoshioka

 

[tsuyoboogie]

To be fair, Kao's spins need Jesus and Shun's edge on his flip is... not good, he's gotten calls on it pretty much every time he's done it, but I do feel like sometimes the top 2 are given the benefit of the doubt where others are not. Fortunately, that wasn't an issue today, I don't think Shoma/Yuma had anything ignored, but it is also a little sad to see great skaters get stingy scores.

First let me say, I'm not advocating judges ignore elements being executed improperly
If it's being done wrong, call it

Yes, Shun has received an unclear edge call on his 4F multiple times this season but never an actual "e"
For the 4F! Shun still received full base value for the jump but lost over 2 points in BV for the 4Fe
He and his coaching team should've considered the multiple ! more seriously but I also understand Shun questioning if they didn't call "e" before, why now at Nationals?
In this tight field of Men, those 2 points can be the difference between a podium finish and 6th...possibly even 8th

I'm not going to defend Kao's ugly spins but can someone please tell the kid what the problem is so he can address it?
It seems he's not receiving consistent feedback regarding this issue which is why he's getting so frustrated
He also does a CSSp in his FS which is just as janky but that one has never been called invalid so what's the problem?
No wonder he's suffering from recurring stomach pain and nausea...

OT but Kao better go get that checked out stat!
Mitsuki Sumoto suffered from chronic, idiopathic Gastroenteritis later in his skating career (started about Kao's age now) which ultimately led to his early retirement

 

[Holy Headband]

First let me say, I'm not advocating judges ignore elements being executed improperly
If it's being done wrong, call it

Yes, Shun has received an unclear edge call on his 4F multiple times this season but never an actual "e"
For the 4F! Shun still received full base value for the jump but lost over 2 points in BV for the 4Fe
He and his coaching team should've considered the multiple ! more seriously but I also understand Shun questioning if they didn't call "e" before, why now at Nationals?
In this tight field of Men, those 2 points can be the difference between a podium finish and 6th...possibly even 8th

I'm not going to defend Kao's ugly spins but can someone please tell the kid what the problem is so he can address it?
It seems he's not receiving consistent feedback regarding this issue which is why he's getting so frustrated
He also does a CSSp in his FS which is just as janky but that one has never been called invalid so what's the problem?
No wonder he's suffering from recurring stomach pain and nausea...

OT but Kao better go get that checked out stat!
Mitsuki Sumoto suffered from chronic, idiopathic Gastroenteritis later in his skating career (started about Kao's age now) which ultimately led to his early retirement

As far as I remember, there are certain errors that should result in reduced base value in the free skate but would be enough to invalidate the entire spin in the short according to the rules. See here:

https://usfigureskating.org/sites/default/files/media-files/Scoring%20Cheat%20Sheet.pdf

 

[Jumping_Bean]

He also does a CSSp in his FS which is just as janky but that one has never been called invalid so what's the problem?

I've not rewatched this specific spin closely, i.e. I can't say what the issue was here specifically, but in general spin rules are a lot stricter in the Short which could go some way to explaining why his FS spin hasn't been called invalid.

 

[tsuyoboogie]

As far as I remember, there are certain errors that should result in reduced base value in the free skate but would be enough to invalidate the entire spin in the short according to the rules. See here:

https://usfigureskating.org/sites/default/files/media-files/Scoring%20Cheat%20Sheet.pdf

I've not rewatched this specific spin closely, i.e. I can't say what the issue was here specifically, but in general spin rules are a lot stricter in the Short which could go some way to explaining why his FS spin hasn't been called invalid.

Thank you both for sharing that info (I really do appreciate it) but I had already checked the ISU tech handbook before my post
Apparently, a CSSp would need to have at least 6 revolutions on each foot
If the required revolutions are not met in the FS a V would be applied whereas in the SP the spin would be considered invalid
So what I should've said was "Why hasn't Kao's janky CSSp received a V in the FS when it's been called invalid in the SP three times this season"
I finally had a chance to go back and scrutinize this spin and it's possible that the spin after the change of foot, if you count from when he gets low enough into position, may have been less than half a revolution short
The issue doesn't seem to be with the CSSp on its own but getting enough revolutions in before the program ends
This would make sense since though his FS CSSp hasn't received a V, his CCoSp which is the last spin in his FS has
Kao has mentioned that he's having a difficult time getting all the elements done before the program is over and they would have to change some of the choreography to compensate for that problem

 

[rabidline]

Just want to thank you @tsuyoboogie for your generosity in sharing the videos as always and I think I saw a quote from Kao yesterday that he understands better what the problem is with his spins after the SP- so I also hope he can adjust them soon!

 

[Sai Bon]

Men's SP video
Videos are not high quality but can be increased up to 720p by clicking on the settings gear
All performances were taken from the FOD livestream (no commentary)
I did experience some streaming issues (glitching, freezing and jumping ahead...as well as the stream just dying )
I went back and recaptured programs that I remembered were interrupted by said issues however,
I haven't checked each video thoroughly so some may still be affected
Please let me know if there are any problems with the links or video listed below

Warmup Group 1
1. Sena Takahashi - 2023 Jr Nat’l 8th
2. Sakura Odagaki
3. Seigo Tauchi - 2023 Jr Nat’l 6th
4. Daiya Ebihara - 2023 Jr Nat’l 7th
5. Tsudoi Suto - 2023 Jr Nat’l 3rd
6. Taiga Nishino - 2023 Jr Nat’l 5th

Warmup Group 2
7. Shunsuke Nakamura - 2023 Jr Nat’l Champion
8. Kazuki Kushida
9. Takumi Sugiyama
10. Kazuki Hasegawa
11. Minato Shiga
12. Yuto Kishina

Warmup Group 3
13. Lucas Tsuyoshi Honda
14. Haru Kakiuchi - 2023 Jr Nat’l 4th
15. Haruya Sasaki
16. Keisuke Kadowaki
17. Ryota Kitamura
18. Rio Nakata - 2023 Jr Nat’l 2nd

Warmup Group 4
19. Koshiro Shimada
20. Tatsuya Tsuboi
21. Sota Yamamoto
22. Kao Miura
23. Shun Sato
24. Sena Miyake

Warmup Group 5
25. Kosho Oshima
26. Kazuki Tomono
27. Takeru Amine Kataise
28. Yuma Kagiyama
29. Shoma Uno
30. Nozomu Yoshioka

Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!

 

[cohkaix]

Sad news:

Although there's no competition for men today, there's actually practice time. And according to this:

https://x.com/hitkurasawa/status/1738062808632496629?s=20

Tsudoi Suto had a fall in practice, and may have hurt his right ankle. So he decides to WD from the FS.

 

[CoyoteChris]

The delayed broadcast was super annoying...Decided to go to sleep before they showed Koshiro... At least I'm glad they showed everyone, unlike certain broadcasters who cut skaters for the sake of time...

ITA. The their only redemption was showing all those cute young 6 year old skater pics who are now stars....and of course the beer commercials.

 

[rabidline]

Oh no... I hope Tsudoi recovers soon. He received a lot of attention yesterday, with the audience (online and offline) praising his skating. The practice today for the men was super early though

 

[auser]

Men's SP video

Thank you so much for these videos @tsuyoboogie! You are a wonderful human.

 

[Crowdproud]

Oh c'mon, tech panel. Why can't Shun break 90 with that clean skate?!

Shun Sato has a nice 4L; why is he going for 4F & getting consistently called on it for the edge?

 

[Blue-Kat]

Shun Sato has a nice 4L; why is he going for 4F & getting consistently called on it for the edge?

Jackie Wong has a possible explanation:
https://x.com/rockerskating/status/1737784827389378579?s=20

 

[Crowdproud]

Jackie Wong has a possible explanation:
https://x.com/rockerskating/status/1737784827389378579?s=20

Thanks -- makes sense.

 

[RatedPG]

Men's SP video
Videos are not high quality but can be increased up to 720p by clicking on the settings gear
All performances were taken from the FOD livestream (no commentary)
I did experience some streaming issues (glitching, freezing and jumping ahead...as well as the stream just dying )
I went back and recaptured programs that I remembered were interrupted by said issues however,
I haven't checked each video thoroughly so some may still be affected
Please let me know if there are any problems with the links or video listed below

Warmup Group 1
1. Sena Takahashi - 2023 Jr Nat’l 8th
2. Sakura Odagaki
3. Seigo Tauchi - 2023 Jr Nat’l 6th
4. Daiya Ebihara - 2023 Jr Nat’l 7th
5. Tsudoi Suto - 2023 Jr Nat’l 3rd
6. Taiga Nishino - 2023 Jr Nat’l 5th

Warmup Group 2
7. Shunsuke Nakamura - 2023 Jr Nat’l Champion
8. Kazuki Kushida
9. Takumi Sugiyama
10. Kazuki Hasegawa
11. Minato Shiga
12. Yuto Kishina

Warmup Group 3
13. Lucas Tsuyoshi Honda
14. Haru Kakiuchi - 2023 Jr Nat’l 4th
15. Haruya Sasaki
16. Keisuke Kadowaki
17. Ryota Kitamura
18. Rio Nakata - 2023 Jr Nat’l 2nd

Warmup Group 4
19. Koshiro Shimada
20. Tatsuya Tsuboi
21. Sota Yamamoto
22. Kao Miura
23. Shun Sato
24. Sena Miyake

Warmup Group 5
25. Kosho Oshima
26. Kazuki Tomono
27. Takeru Amine Kataise
28. Yuma Kagiyama
29. Shoma Uno
30. Nozomu Yoshioka

@tsuyoboogie Thanks so much!! These competitions are too late for me to watch LIVE. I was able to watch this competition at my own pace yesterday. I could watch one group and then eat dinner, etc!! Even better than watching it live!! Thanks so much!!

Shoma is looking really good
Yuma - fall on his 4S! Good luck in the free skate

I have no idea who will win bronze between the rest of the four.. I’m rooting for Kazuki because I like his artistry more than the other three

Good luck to all the competitors

 

[Moon322]

It seems like JSF still only care about Uno and Kagiyama who both had mistakes today. Uno again without a 4-3 and Kagiyama falling on the 4S.
Uno only got those q calls at NHK in order to help Kagiyama get into the Grand Prix Final.

All others, especially Shun and Kao are judged too harshly. The bias of JSF has always been too obvious in the past years.