Let me clarify what I meant in the question regarding whether Evan had improved. I meant in performance. Until...well now...I would watch her, watch him and then quickly switch back to her because I found him to be totally unengaging. This time I was drawn to him and spent as watch time watching him as her.
2023 Skate America Rhythm Dance
- Thread starter dorispulaski
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Okay, the following post may be controversial, and ID is very opinionated. But here are my views about the placements of the teams. I'll sum up below my views on each team as well. I also might come off as a hater for some teams, but this is just my honest opinion.
My Views:
1/2) Lopereva/Brissaud = LA/LA
3/4/5) Chock/Bates = Taschlers = Green/Parsons
6) Smart/Dieck
Technically, in terms of quality of skating, the French team was One of the best teams by far. Giume shouldn't do choreography if he gives them that program though. For me, the team of the night from a technical standpoint. From technical standpoint I'd have them overall in first, however LA/LA better composition and performance.
La/La were phenomenal today, on route back to what they can produce. still felt a little insecure in themselves (i.e. tentative or wobbles on some turns). A few mistakes on edges and turn technique, which is why I help them into 2nd.
Tachlers: Speed, effortless look to their skating. Not a fan of their choreo. It felt a bit flat as if they were skating through the music. Lot's of athleticism, just missing nuance and grace.
Green/Parsons: Fantastic SS, not a fan of choreo. Turn technique was on fire in pattern step.
Chock/Bates Watching midline in slow mo, and being really scrutinising (Although, with camera angles the panel don't have), I would have given Madi Level 2, and that's giving her benefit of the doubt. Also to get that GOE with toe-pushing and being slow in the StSq to get speed (again, discovered in slow mo, not just the intentional toe taps but actually on the pushes). Twizzles looked off but still got that level of GOE. and just generally a few compositional aspects were a bit jarring (i.e. moonwalking with queen music). Amazing lift though and good samba construction.
Smart/Dieck: Fan of choreo, skating better than before. Olivia is phenomenal performer, and Tim is improving. The lip synching threw me off a lot. I explain down below why I'm not a lip synching fan.
Browns: Elegant, choreo not as advanced as other athletes, but right up their street. They had good control, good kneebend and good flow.
Mrazeks: oooh. I have a lot to say. Their skating ability is a 10. Their speed is a 10. their edges are 10s.
But I was thrown off by Random leg kicks, skating through the music without really feeling the music. Overall, it was a speed skating exercise with demonstrations of good turn technique thrown in. It didn't feel like an ice dance program.
Lim/Quan: great team, developing further. Love them, and can't wait to see them.
Harris/Chan: have little to say about them. They feel similar to previous seasons.
On the topic of Lip synching:
For me it actually detracts from interpretation. You're meant to interpret the music - the feelings behind the music. Embody the music. You're not supposed to interpret the act of singing the music. For me it turns from a couple trying to perform to the story of the music, into a couple trying to pretend to be in a music video. It kind of "breaks the 4th wall" for a lack of a better term. It might just be personal preference, but not for me.
Edit:
Also, I noticed a lack of dance holds amount many teams. Despite it being in ISU recommendations. The few teams that used dance holds used very open ones. Gage and oona were one of the few teams using "Real dance hods", and actually it's much more technically challenging to build speed with closed dance holds, so I think that deserves some appreciation.
My Views:
1/2) Lopereva/Brissaud = LA/LA
3/4/5) Chock/Bates = Taschlers = Green/Parsons
6) Smart/Dieck
Technically, in terms of quality of skating, the French team was One of the best teams by far. Giume shouldn't do choreography if he gives them that program though. For me, the team of the night from a technical standpoint. From technical standpoint I'd have them overall in first, however LA/LA better composition and performance.
La/La were phenomenal today, on route back to what they can produce. still felt a little insecure in themselves (i.e. tentative or wobbles on some turns). A few mistakes on edges and turn technique, which is why I help them into 2nd.
Tachlers: Speed, effortless look to their skating. Not a fan of their choreo. It felt a bit flat as if they were skating through the music. Lot's of athleticism, just missing nuance and grace.
Green/Parsons: Fantastic SS, not a fan of choreo. Turn technique was on fire in pattern step.
Chock/Bates Watching midline in slow mo, and being really scrutinising (Although, with camera angles the panel don't have), I would have given Madi Level 2, and that's giving her benefit of the doubt. Also to get that GOE with toe-pushing and being slow in the StSq to get speed (again, discovered in slow mo, not just the intentional toe taps but actually on the pushes). Twizzles looked off but still got that level of GOE. and just generally a few compositional aspects were a bit jarring (i.e. moonwalking with queen music). Amazing lift though and good samba construction.
Smart/Dieck: Fan of choreo, skating better than before. Olivia is phenomenal performer, and Tim is improving. The lip synching threw me off a lot. I explain down below why I'm not a lip synching fan.
Browns: Elegant, choreo not as advanced as other athletes, but right up their street. They had good control, good kneebend and good flow.
Mrazeks: oooh. I have a lot to say. Their skating ability is a 10. Their speed is a 10. their edges are 10s.
But I was thrown off by Random leg kicks, skating through the music without really feeling the music. Overall, it was a speed skating exercise with demonstrations of good turn technique thrown in. It didn't feel like an ice dance program.
Lim/Quan: great team, developing further. Love them, and can't wait to see them.
Harris/Chan: have little to say about them. They feel similar to previous seasons.
On the topic of Lip synching:
For me it actually detracts from interpretation. You're meant to interpret the music - the feelings behind the music. Embody the music. You're not supposed to interpret the act of singing the music. For me it turns from a couple trying to perform to the story of the music, into a couple trying to pretend to be in a music video. It kind of "breaks the 4th wall" for a lack of a better term. It might just be personal preference, but not for me.
Edit:
Also, I noticed a lack of dance holds amount many teams. Despite it being in ISU recommendations. The few teams that used dance holds used very open ones. Gage and oona were one of the few teams using "Real dance hods", and actually it's much more technically challenging to build speed with closed dance holds, so I think that deserves some appreciation.
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If you want to look at their previous partners, Madi & Greg were both small. Emily & Evan were both big.
At the same time, Meryl and Charlie were both on the small side, and Tessa & Scott were larger.
At the same time, Meryl and Charlie were both on the small side, and Tessa & Scott were larger.
Emily had such pretty feet but she seemed to need a fair amount of leg room with Evan. And after the injuries who can blame him for wanting to try something different.
Some thoughts on the top 4:
Much respect to Lopareva/Brissaud for choosing unconventional music. Loved her knee slide. Thought it still looks like they are growing into the program. There are a lot of arm and leg movements that hit quickly and specifically on the music that aren't quite sharp yet.
Lajoie/Lagha looked great here. This is definitely the most we've seen Zach take centre stage. Sharp twizzles, fast in the rotational lift. It's coming together.
Green/Parsons I think made a good choice to change from Paula Abdul. The balance of the two songs is a little jarring. I think the first song works particularly well for them.
Chock/Bates: there was a lot to like about the choreography, but I found the music cuts really jarring. From 'Another One Bites the Dust' to 'Who Wants to Live Forever' was especially abrupt and odd. Thumbs down on the music edit. The cartwheel and the rotational lift were sensational. The twizzles were visibly off — two sets.
Much respect to Lopareva/Brissaud for choosing unconventional music. Loved her knee slide. Thought it still looks like they are growing into the program. There are a lot of arm and leg movements that hit quickly and specifically on the music that aren't quite sharp yet.
Lajoie/Lagha looked great here. This is definitely the most we've seen Zach take centre stage. Sharp twizzles, fast in the rotational lift. It's coming together.
Green/Parsons I think made a good choice to change from Paula Abdul. The balance of the two songs is a little jarring. I think the first song works particularly well for them.
Chock/Bates: there was a lot to like about the choreography, but I found the music cuts really jarring. From 'Another One Bites the Dust' to 'Who Wants to Live Forever' was especially abrupt and odd. Thumbs down on the music edit. The cartwheel and the rotational lift were sensational. The twizzles were visibly off — two sets.
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Yes. Neither Igor nor Marina liked the idea of them teaming up, as the Reddit shows.
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Just FYI, I always look forward to reading your perspective on this discipline as a current era ice dancer. Not that it makes you automatically correct, but I find the criticisms that you do raise are fairly constructive and specific. So, I don't find it come across as hating on anyone
I like Lopareva/Brissaud's skating qualities. I'm hoping they'll have breakout moment sometime soon.
Zanni's teams are very powerful and fast but I feel like they need to work on dynamics a bit. Sprinkling in a few softer quiet moments here and there would do wonders (talking more in general; here their energy works quite well for the 80s)
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Just a comment on L/B's music. In the French speaking world, Mylène Farmer is like Madonna or so. It's conventional for most of us Frenchies. However, it was very much on my wish list when they announced 80s theme and I am thrilled they chose it. The other good choice in that same department is Bronsard-Richmond's Rita Mitsouko RD... It's nice and refreshing that French pop music in skating is not from a musical
or Celine, or Lara
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Emily Samuelson is 5'4, Madi is 5'2, Evan is 6'2, so it's not that much of a difference b/t the Ladies he partnered. Meryl and Charlie were 2 inches shorter than Tessa and Scott respectively.
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Yes, I meant unconventional in the field this year where everyone seems to be going for the very much expected, lol.Just a comment on L/B's music. In the French speaking world, Mylène Farmer is like Madonna or so. It's conventional for most of us Frenchies. However, it was very much on my wish list when they announced 80s theme and I am thrilled they chose it. The other good choice in that same department is Bronsard-Richmond's Rita Mitsouko RD... It's nice and refreshing that French pop music in skating is not from a musical
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Sorry, gang.
(Not that I understand ID judging, so I am just a hanger on).
I don't understand the "Madi and Evan are so overscored" refrain. Particularly here. They were *miles" ahead of the teams that came before them. I saw one twizzle "off" (at least I think I saw it) but that's it. The other teams were either slower, had less refinement, fewer striking elements, etc.
And I quite liked many of the other teams.
Now to rest until men.....
Nothing new here... it is basically cheating ... ice dancing has become notorious for this.. SkateGate was fixed up 18 or 19 positions ie totally fixed...
So the 4 element (dance rhythm seq.) was very good GOE 5.40..
But the rest was marginal GEO around 1.00 (my view)
I would have placed them 3rd or 4th with 76 points...
Vick
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I laugh every time I hear that.
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My sister loved those.
I saw dances yesterday, not making any detailed technical analysis.
Holly & Jason - I liked the very beginning of the program and the first part of Step Sequence.
Hannah & Ye - I agree that Hannah's dress looked great and chic. She was dancing, it looked good, the couple had nice entry into Grand Prix big stage.
Katerina & Daniel - the last part is danced nicely, in the first two parts couple is more dynamic than music needs. Katerina's kicking in Choreographic Rhythm Sequence and stroking Katerina's head is disturbing for me. Twizzles are one of best at the senior world, but with Katerina's fighting in the Second Set I understand GOE +1.6 points only.
Oona & Gage - one of my top 2 Choreographic Rhythm Sequences yet, it was nice. BIG thanks to choreographers for choosing more dance holds, closer skating. It looked so much better than Sequences of other teams in hand in hand holds. Oona & Gage should get additional points for dance holds.
Olivia & Tim - one of few dances I get 80's vibes from. In presentation I already saw them being stronger at some Challenger, but I understand they just started their journey. But still I liked it.
Marjorie & Zachary - very good attempt to get Thriller on the ice, choreography is difficult, couple is dancing. Especially Zachary is getting demonically into the dance. One thing which disturbed me from time to time - the position of fingers which was fully ballroom most of time. While in Pattern Step Sequence Zachary was doing arms with finger's position like claws, in opening Step Sequence those "claws" were mostly missing and especially when pair elevated both arms with perfectly extended ballroom fingers, personally for me it was deleting Thriller expression. Little uncertainties here and there.
Evgenia & Geoffrey - the dance is not my cup of tea, but I appreciate it was difficult to express and it was expressed very well. Very good choreography. Little uncertainties here and there.
Caroline & Michael - I didn't believe that having so short time for the new program can lead to good one. But it can in their case. Program suits them. I got 80's vibes. I hope to see that program grows during next competitions, having more attack, wildness and courage in presentation.
Natalie & Filip - one of my top 2 Choreographic Rhythm Sequences yet. Great dancing and once again great dancing. Especially Natalie is using whole body while dancing, her plasticity is enormous. Last season I praised couple for dancing latin movements WHILE skating...in comparison with some other couples who executed stacionary dancing...this season they have more stacionary dancing and I would reduce it. For me they were probably second best. (But I agree that Canadians and French had more difficult choreography and were skating more close to each other.)
I would definitely create requirement for maximally 3 seconds in stacionary dancing per dance.
Madison & Evan - I am glad they continue. I got 80's vibes. I don't remember they would ever have that good Rhythm / Short Dance program. I always saw Evan like a great partner, but I never saw dancer in him. Until now. He is dancing, he is dancing very well. I think that Madison didn't feel well after the fall at practise, but she was very brave, she came and showed a great dance. Choreography especially in the first part is great. I hope to see this dance grows at next competitions to create even more gorgeous overall expression.
Holly & Jason - I liked the very beginning of the program and the first part of Step Sequence.
Hannah & Ye - I agree that Hannah's dress looked great and chic. She was dancing, it looked good, the couple had nice entry into Grand Prix big stage.
Katerina & Daniel - the last part is danced nicely, in the first two parts couple is more dynamic than music needs. Katerina's kicking in Choreographic Rhythm Sequence and stroking Katerina's head is disturbing for me. Twizzles are one of best at the senior world, but with Katerina's fighting in the Second Set I understand GOE +1.6 points only.
Oona & Gage - one of my top 2 Choreographic Rhythm Sequences yet, it was nice. BIG thanks to choreographers for choosing more dance holds, closer skating. It looked so much better than Sequences of other teams in hand in hand holds. Oona & Gage should get additional points for dance holds.
Olivia & Tim - one of few dances I get 80's vibes from. In presentation I already saw them being stronger at some Challenger, but I understand they just started their journey. But still I liked it.
Marjorie & Zachary - very good attempt to get Thriller on the ice, choreography is difficult, couple is dancing. Especially Zachary is getting demonically into the dance. One thing which disturbed me from time to time - the position of fingers which was fully ballroom most of time. While in Pattern Step Sequence Zachary was doing arms with finger's position like claws, in opening Step Sequence those "claws" were mostly missing and especially when pair elevated both arms with perfectly extended ballroom fingers, personally for me it was deleting Thriller expression. Little uncertainties here and there.
Evgenia & Geoffrey - the dance is not my cup of tea, but I appreciate it was difficult to express and it was expressed very well. Very good choreography. Little uncertainties here and there.
Caroline & Michael - I didn't believe that having so short time for the new program can lead to good one. But it can in their case. Program suits them. I got 80's vibes. I hope to see that program grows during next competitions, having more attack, wildness and courage in presentation.
Natalie & Filip - one of my top 2 Choreographic Rhythm Sequences yet. Great dancing and once again great dancing. Especially Natalie is using whole body while dancing, her plasticity is enormous. Last season I praised couple for dancing latin movements WHILE skating...in comparison with some other couples who executed stacionary dancing...this season they have more stacionary dancing and I would reduce it. For me they were probably second best. (But I agree that Canadians and French had more difficult choreography and were skating more close to each other.)
I would definitely create requirement for maximally 3 seconds in stacionary dancing per dance.
Madison & Evan - I am glad they continue. I got 80's vibes. I don't remember they would ever have that good Rhythm / Short Dance program. I always saw Evan like a great partner, but I never saw dancer in him. Until now. He is dancing, he is dancing very well. I think that Madison didn't feel well after the fall at practise, but she was very brave, she came and showed a great dance. Choreography especially in the first part is great. I hope to see this dance grows at next competitions to create even more gorgeous overall expression.
