Plushenko to Resume His Eligibility to skate ISU Competitions

[blue_idealist]

IIRC he asked Kurt Browning for choreography, but then Kurt hadn't time and so nothing was done.
So, I think Zhulin is doing at least one of his programs.

Seems Plushenko wasn't high on Kurt's priority list?

 

[Violet Bliss]

Seems Plushenko wasn't high on Kurt's priority list?

Kurt has a long list. He gave up touring the US when his first child was born. He is a family man, a skating commentator, a touring skating star, and a tv show host.

Kurt says he has no patience for coaching and he does very few choreographies for others, probably for the same reason. He had a bad experience with Joubert which he didn't like to talk about except once when pressed. He had cleared his schedule for Jourbert who was a no show, without even answering Kurt's email inquiries.

 

[Olympia]

For real? Joubert did that? Well, that ends any admiration I had for him. How could he do that to any professional colleague, but even more, how could anyone do that to Kurt?

 

[Violet Bliss]

I thought I better find some record of Kurt's interview regarding choreographing for Brian Joubert before Joubert's fans come for my head.

http://www.kurtfiles.com/articles/article.php?id=765&cat=SOI

Q: In the last few years, you seemed poised to take over the choreography world, choreographing for skaters like Evan Lysacek, Carolina Kostner, and Alissa Czisny. In particular, previous interviews made it sound like you were going to work with Brian Joubert through the 2010 Olympics. Why did you back off of it this year, and what happened with Joubert?

I had to put choreography for other people on the back burner, as they say. It was taking so much of my time and I was not doing my own training. I also could not follow up enough for the athletes. It was not fair to them and not good for my skating either. I was having knee trouble and not taking care of myself...not good. It had to go.

Joubert... well he was to come and work with me, but I had jury duty so I could not promise I would be available when he wanted to work so he went elsewhere. He was to join up with me later to do the short, but he neither showed up or called or emailed. I waited for some sort of word until I finally called out to him, but heard nothing for at least a week, so I emailed again and got the email back saying that work had gone so smoothly with his new choreographer that they just worked on a new short together as well. This is all fine, and it is his career, and I was telling him he needed to expand how many choreographers he was working with and not use just me, and so I would have been fine with all that, except he made it clear he was coming back for the short and I was clearing my schedule for the expected visit. How can a skater just get a solo done by another person and not even call to let me know I have no idea.

 

[seniorita]

For real? Joubert did that? Well, that ends any admiration I had for him. How could he do that to any professional colleague, but even more, how could anyone do that to Kurt?

Out of topic but I m in a seminar where just about yesterday we were taught that we need to make pc users understand how wrong is the alarming trendy expression (internet) link or it didnt happen. That what it is on internet needs triple check and what it is on internet on a link might not have happened.

 

[Medusa]

For real? Joubert did that? Well, that ends any admiration I had for him. How could he do that to any professional colleague, but even more, how could anyone do that to Kurt?

Joubert was clearly unprofessional here, but I also find it kind of tacky to talk about that in interviews. Browning could have easily talked about scheduling conflicts or a misunderstanding concerning their schedules. If skating happened to be the real world, it would have been unprofessional from both (imagine being a student and having that kind of confiict with a professor - and then the professor gives an interview to a university magazine, including the details of the conflict and the name of the student in question).

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Wilkomen, Bienvenue, Welcome back, Medusa.

I agree with you. It should be in Kurt's memoirs when he gets around to writing them.

 

[seniorita]

Ab kurt:If you wanna talk about it at least do it somewhere flashy, go to oprah!Nice to see you here medusa

 

[Violet Bliss]

Kurt had been reluctant to talk about the incident before and this was the only occasion that I'm aware of his giving an explanation of what happened among the many subjects in this interview. The Kurtfile is not one of public media but is his dedicated fan site with a close association with Kurt himself. I am glad to hear some of his thoughts on various subjects in his life from the man himself on this site. I see nothing wrong with him clearing the air once for his fans without constantly griping about it to all who asked. Obviously even skating fans such as GS members are not all aware of this interview and Kurt's account, which neither Joubert nor Kurt himself, or anybody else, has contested as false.

 

[Buttercup]

Ab kurt:If you wanna talk about it at least do it somewhere flashy, go to oprah!Nice to see you here medusa

I thought Oprah isn't doing the show anymore?

So Joubert has again made it into a Plushenko thread... since he's here and Plushy is probably on vacation: clearly, something went quite wrong between Browning and Joubert, as was obvious once the former began criticizing Joubert's programs and skating shortly after the collaboration ended. We have Kurt's account, but do not have Brian's (I imagine he does not read Kurt's website). I find it interesting that for several years afterward, Joubert was very much opposed to any suggestion that he work with NA choreographers/coaches, and seemed concerned about whether they would have his best interests before them. Maybe he's paranoid, maybe the interviewers misunderstood - but maybe there's more to it than either party has shared with fans. That having been said, I agree with Medusa that this sort of thing is best kept confidential, no matter who the people involved are.

Really, it was a pity it didn't work out. All For You was a fabulous program.

 

[seniorita]

Hey happy to see you here also, r we doing a reunion party?plushy is not on vacation he is following mishin camps doing rehab stuff for now, he is in tartu now.http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/6149/655842t54hc053.jpg

 

[blue_idealist]

I don't think Kurt was that wrong to talk about it. He didn't exactly call Joubert dirty names or anything like that, and Joubert is completely free to give his side if he wants to as well..

 

[Olympia]

Out of topic but I m in a seminar where just about yesterday we were taught that we need to make pc users understand how wrong is the alarming trendy expression (internet) link or it didnt happen. That what it is on internet needs triple check and what it is on internet on a link might not have happened.

I don't generally jump to conclusions based on a forum post, but it was Kurt, so I reacted. You know how it is! I have a very small "life list" of skaters about whom I would immediately respond. (Michelle...Kurt....can't think of the other two or three....)

 

[let`s talk]

I also find it kind of tacky to talk about that in interviews. Browning could have easily talked about scheduling conflicts or a misunderstanding concerning their schedules.

Kurt is future Chan.

 

[Violet Bliss]

Kurt is future Chan.

Not missing an opportunity to bring up and deride a favorite target, even if such statement is totally utterly ridiculous, eh? Kurt Browning is highly and deservedly respected in the skating world as one of the greatest ever, and Chan is on his journey to be one of such status as well.

Joubert was clearly unprofessional here, but I also find it kind of tacky to talk about that in interviews.

Not to infer more than or outside of this incidence, what is tacky is Joubert's dealing with Kurt in this situation. It is not just unprofessional, because such behaviour is as tacky outside of professional situations and relationships.

Now Kurt is called tacky because he answered truthfully about someone else's tacky behaviour and Kurt has conveniently become the focus of criticism. Perceived unfavorable light is shed on a favored person so the person revealing the behaviour is faulted. In a switched role scenario where a beloved person reveals such behaviour by a strongly disliked perosn, there would be gleefully righteous pile-ons on the already disliked person instead. (And then other people would speak out to ensure lively arguments. )

Browning could have easily talked about scheduling conflicts or a misunderstanding concerning their schedules.

Neither "scheduling conflicts" nor "a misunderstanding concerning their schedules" is true to Browning's knowledge and saying so would be a lie. But honesty is unprofessional while lying is the proper way to deal with inquiries? :sheesh: Unfortunately, this seems to be entrenched in today's corporate culture where bringing up improprieties is called ratting and deemed worse than improprieties themselves. Bad behaviour is to be ignored and covered up by peers.

But Browning is a class act. Prior to and after this interview which is the only occasion he talked about what happened, and I don't believe that is wrong or tacky, he has managed to not answer inqueries without lying and making up stories. :thumbsup:

If skating happened to be the real world, it would have been unprofessional from both (imagine being a student and having that kind of confiict with a professor - and then the professor gives an interview to a university magazine, including the details of the conflict and the name of the student in question).

This is not a relevent comparison at all, so I wouldn't comment on the given scenario. Skating is real world. Browning and Joubert are real people. In this case, the dealing is one professional with another, and one contemporary person with another, when mutual respect and consideration should be expected and accorded. Kurt has no power over Joubert, as evidenced by Joubert's choice of treatment of Kurt who had no recourse (outside of legal litigation which I'm sure was never considered).

 

[Medusa]

Well, you are clearly a much bigger Browning fan than I am a Joubert fan and I salute your unwavering loyalty and devotion towards him.

But Browning is a class act. Prior to and after this interview which is the only occasion he talked about what happened, and I don't believe that is wrong or tacky, he has managed to not answer inqueries without lying and making up stories.

He didn't need to make up a story to get out of the situation. He could have refused to answer the question. "This was in the past, it's done now." "I'd prefer not to talk about this." No lie, no made up story.

Neither "scheduling conflicts" nor "a misunderstanding concerning their schedules" is true to Browning's knowledge and saying so would be a lie. But honesty is unprofessional while lying is the proper way to deal with inquiries? Unfortunately, this seems to be entrenched in today's corporate culture where bringing up improprieties is called ratting and deemed worse than improprieties themselves. Bad behaviour is to be ignored and covered up by peers.

I am not sure I would like to be your co-worker.

 

[Violet Bliss]

Well, you are clearly a much bigger Browning fan than I am a Joubert fan and I salute your unwavering loyalty and devotion towards him.

I have defended various skaters I am not a fan of. I would have found Kurt wrong if the roles were reversed.

He didn't need to make up a story to get out of the situation. He could have refused to answer the question. "This was in the past, it's done now." "I'd prefer not to talk about this." No lie, no made up story.

Then we are in agreement. I was quoting and commenting on your exact suggestions that Kurt should have said in response to queries.

I am not sure I would like to be your co-worker.

I almost always work on my own but, when employed, I always stay out of office politics and gossips. I respect privacy, confidentiality, and trust, which is different from covering up for someone or being made or expected to keep mum about all deeds of others. There is no need to harp on being wronged, but an honest answer is not tacky or an attack on the other person who doesn't seem to consider it something to hide.

I salute whistle blowers for their courage and often personal sacrifices.

 

[Buttercup]

Well, you are clearly a much bigger Browning fan than I am a Joubert fan and I salute your unwavering loyalty and devotion towards him.

He didn't need to make up a story to get out of the situation. He could have refused to answer the question. "This was in the past, it's done now." "I'd prefer not to talk about this." No lie, no made up story.

I bet it could have been some sort of misunderstanding, though. I've done some research on conflict situations and one thing that you usually see is that people can have dramatically different narratives about the same events. I don't think it's that far-fetched that there was some miscommunication there. I've read many accounts of Joubert being stubborn and maybe hot-headed in training, but not that he's inconsiderate.

Well, it doesn't matter anymore. Brian's working with Wilson, Kurt's plenty busy with his projects, and Plushy has a nice new haircut. All's well that ends well!

 

[Violet Bliss]

Since Joubert hasn't said anything that we know of, it's only Kurt's credibility in question. This is considered too trivial for anybody to push for validation. But if pushed, Kurt should have the emails to back up his version of the story.

 

[Mathman]

Kurt's credibility is not in question.

It is too trivial.

Kurt probably deleted his emails.