Mao Asada plans comeback

[Franklin99]

let's all enjoy a gorgeously made and inspiring video - Mao Asada - Spin the World Around

jump to 2:15 for the explosion of 3As.

Beautiful video!

Thanks for sharing!

 

[Ophelia]

Hahahahahahahahaha

 

[Sandpiper]

Well, in nothing else, Mishin's statement has made me ponder Mao's 3A. Though I definitely disagree with him (and frankly, I think he's politicking, not stating his actual opinion), it's true that Mao's 3As in later years--even the best ones she landed--do have a small cheat on the end. Not deserving of <, of course, since she's clearly past the 1/4 mark, but it's not quite fully backwards either.

Not sure if anyone knows why this is? I've been looking through sabinfire's jumpamatron, looking through Mao's 3As at 2010 Olympics, 2010 Worlds, 2008 GPF, ect. Also the wonderful video linked by largeman.

Her 3A actually seems to fly higher than Liza's. She's also pencil-straight in the air, pulled in perfectly tight in the rotation... But for some reason Liza has the cleaner landing. The rotation looks effortless for her, even if she doesn't seem to jump as high or pull in as tight. What exactly does Mao need--to start rotating earlier? To delay her exit a little? Or, as some people suggested, do women really need a specific build for 3A, and Mao sadly just doesn't fit?

Btw, it's still wrong to say Mao never landed a clean 3A. Her 3As pre-puberty looked completely, unmistakably around, like here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_Yy7V-q5jc (2005 GPF)

 

[kiara_bleu]

Well, in nothing else, Mishin's statement has made me ponder Mao's 3A. Though I definitely disagree with him (and frankly, I think he's politicking, not stating his actual opinion), it's true that Mao's 3As in later years--even the best ones she landed--do have a small cheat on the end. Not deserving of <, of course, since she's clearly past the 1/4 mark, but it's not quite fully backwards either.

Thus Mishin's work is done. It doesn't matter if what he said is accurate or not. The more exaggerated his claim is, the more it's going to be reported and repeated. It's going to make some people think, doubt, and look more closely at Mao's jumps. He's hoping that those people would include technicians and judges.

 

[makaihime]

Thus Mishin's work is done. It doesn't matter if what he said is accurate or not. The more exaggerated his claim is, the more it's going to be reported and repeated. It's going to make some people think, doubt, and look more closely at Mao's jumps. He's hoping that those people would include technicians and judges.

:disapp:

 

[Sandpiper]

Thus Mishin's work is done. It doesn't matter if what he said is accurate or not. The more exaggerated his claim is, the more it's going to be reported and repeated. It's going to make some people think, doubt, and look more closely at Mao's jumps. He's hoping that those people would include technicians and judges.

Well, obviously he's speaking to politic for his own skater (like every coach does). But I've actually been thinking about this for a while, though I actually went back to look this time. Why exactly is Mao's 3A on that hazy 1/4-1/8 line? Everything else about the jump looks great.

Forgive me if I'm misunderstanding you, but are you implying we should not discuss something because it would lead to greater scrutiny for Mao/better results for Mishin? Tech specialists have always looked closely at Mao's jumps. I fail to see why we should eliminate the topic (it's not like that would do her any good).

 

[shiroKJ]

It really is disappointing that Mishin would knowingly lie and not only put down another skater but personally insult Mao in an attempt to make his own skater look better. But of course the outrage only applies when its not from someone you support/like.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

I really don't care about what Mishin says at all. I'm not really worried about tech panels being influenced by statements like this because lets face it....if someone is persuaded by obvious rhetoric than was there really much hope in their fairness anyway

Seriously....I'll cross that bridge when and only if we get there. With everything else aside the truth is I'm only interested in seeing what Mao can bring to the table..... blade to ice. Based on current judging trends I'd say all signs seem to point to the fact that she needs to be cleaner than she was on her jumps in the last WC to get scores like she got then. Edge work and rotations are the flavor of the day and she was borderline at times. I love the girl but a piece of me is worried that unless she comes back better than before she may not be as relevant as she was when she left. I really hope she proves me wrong and I pray that the judges are able to reward her skating as a whole, if it is in fact as strong and well rounded as most suspect it will be, with scores that keep her at the top of the heap. I guess I'd define top of the heap as being considered a favorite for 1st at WC. But I think we are in the age of tech first, second, and third with actual quality and cohesiveness of programming back in forth place. Not saying it isn't important and doesn't get rewarded by the judges but I think the tech panels are the most powerful force in FS today but that's.....another thead and besides....... only time will tell so I'm not trying to start bickering about something that hasn't happened. Right now I'm just happy at the thought of seeing a familiar face back on the ice.

 

[gotoschool]

Well, in nothing else, Mishin's statement has made me ponder Mao's 3A. Though I definitely disagree with him (and frankly, I think he's politicking, not stating his actual opinion), it's true that Mao's 3As in later years--even the best ones she landed--do have a small cheat on the end. Not deserving of <, of course, since she's clearly past the 1/4 mark, but it's not quite fully backwards either.

Not sure if anyone knows why this is? I've been looking through sabinfire's jumpamatron, looking through Mao's 3As at 2010 Olympics, 2010 Worlds, 2008 GPF, ect. Also the wonderful video linked by largeman.

Her 3A actually seems to fly higher than Liza's. She's also pencil-straight in the air, pulled in perfectly tight in the rotation... But for some reason Liza has the cleaner landing. The rotation looks effortless for her, even if she doesn't seem to jump as high or pull in as tight. What exactly does Mao need--to start rotating earlier? To delay her exit a little? Or, as some people suggested, do women really need a specific build for 3A, and Mao sadly just doesn't fit?

Btw, it's still wrong to say Mao never landed a clean 3A. Her 3As pre-puberty looked completely, unmistakably around, like here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_Yy7V-q5jc (2005 GPF)

I think Mao's triple axel is the most beautiful because of the excellent height, the delayed rotation (which is a beautiful feature in a jump but can lead to underrotation), her incredibly erect posture, and the acceleration into rapid rotation and beautifully symmetrical revolutions after the delay. she also has very good distance, and intricate transitions and rhythmic movement in and out of the jump. All these features include a wide range of highly visible full body movement and presentation whereas, the slight hooks on the ice on landing are the difference of a couple of inches and often not even visible at least to me in real time. The rotation can also often be argued about. Different people see or perceive different things. The scoring system is what it is and I know I can't change it, but I know that I like Mao's triple axel the best because of all the features I mentioned above. I hope she just has the guts to do the jumps (the triple axel and the triple flip and loop) because they are truly impressive athletically and aesthetically, and, for example, in her last three professional skates all looked rotated to me and the people who were watching with me.

 

[hurrah]

Mao did say she thought she had to at the very least get back to the level she was at at Worlds 2014, so I think she more than anyone else knows she needs to make her technique cleaner to be more competitive. And so, I gather, does Nobuo Sato.

For her and Nobuo Sato, it's just a question of making these improvements without getting injured. Mao doesn't need to rush herself to make those changes. She still has time, if Olympic gold is what she's after, and why else would she continue? She has three full years yet to make that final journey. And Mao is such a dedicated athlete. If anyone can keep herself fit and healthy enough on a day to day basis to make those changes, it would be Mao. And we know Mao has the ability to change her jump technique as long as she is given enough time, because we have already seen the extent to which she was able to retool her jumps already.

Liza, actually, has a whole lot more to do before Olympic comes. She needs to improve her skating skills, her endurance level, her flexibility, none of which come easy. Indeed, I think it is more doable to make technical jump changes than to change one's skating skills, endurance level and flexibility. So Mishin should just concentrate on helping his own skater, rather than waste his time dissing other skaters.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Forgive me if I'm misunderstanding you, but are you implying we should not discuss something because it would lead to greater scrutiny for Mao/better results for Mishin? Tech specialists have always looked closely at Mao's jumps. I fail to see why we should eliminate the topic (it's not like that would do her any good).

I agree with the premise and I too believe there should be room for discussion on all skater's abilities both strengths and weaknesses. However, I do think Kiara_bleu and others are saying that Mishin is free to politic but maybe saying lies in the press should be off limits. And I agree with Kiara_bleu that when things are said like this people begin to repeat it or at least the notion of it may tend to grow.

I don't like comments like this at all. I remember Jeff Buttle saying something rude and equally as ridiculous about Liza winning the WC. I just don't like any sourpuss attitudes be it from posters, skaters/coaches I personally know, and mostly....the top professionals in this sport.

 

[Sandpiper]

I think Mao's triple axel is the most beautiful because of the excellent height, the delayed rotation (which is a beautiful feature in a jump but can lead to underrotation), her incredibly erect posture, and the acceleration into rapid rotation and beautifully symmetrical revolutions after the delay, also she appears to have very good distance, and intricate transitions and rhythmic movement in and out of the jump. All these features include a wide range of highly visible full body movement and presentation whereas, the slight hooks on the ice on landing are the difference of a couple of inches and often not even visible at least to me in real time. The rotation can also often be argued about. Different people see or perceive different things. The scoring system is what it is and I know I can't change it, but I know that I like Mao's triple axel the best because of all the features I mentioned above. I hope she just has the guts to do the jumps (the triple axel and the triple flip and loop) because they are beautiful and in her last three professional skates looked rotated to me and the people who were watching with me.

I completely agree with you, that little hooks on the ice mean little next to all the other positive features of the jump. Unfortunately, that's not what the system rewards. :hopelessness: Not only do < jumps get docked BV, they're docked GOE too. Her last three triple axels looked rotated past the 1/4 mark, so I think they deserve full credit, but that hazy line opens the door for tech panels.

To rephrase... there's been a lot of talk made of Mao's technique, probably because of her UR issues (and it started looong before Mishin said anything). The original translator brought up that perhaps Mishin saw something fundamentally wrong with her technique. My personal issue is, like you, I find Mao's jumps otherwise quite beautiful. Unlike other skaters with UR issues (Mirai and Ashley come to mind), Mao actually has huge jumps with tight, fast rotation. I guess I was just wondering if anyone had technical insight, but I guess I shouldn't have brought it up...

I agree with the premise and I too believe there should be room for discussion on all skater's abilities both strengths and weaknesses. However, I do think Kiara_bleu and others are saying that Mishin is free to politic but maybe saying lies in the press should be off limits. And I agree with Kiara_bleu that when things are said like this people begin to repeat it or at least the notion of it may tend to grow.

I don't like comments like this at all. I remember Jeff Buttle saying something rude and equally as ridiculous about Liza winning the WC. I just don't like any sourpuss attitudes be it from posters, skaters/coaches I personally know, and mostly....the top professionals in this sport.

Of course Mishin shouldn't have said what he did (and Jeff and Patrick as well)... but he did say that, so what can we do? Pretend he said nothing?

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Of course Mishin shouldn't have said what he did (and Jeff and Patrick as well)... but he did say that, so what can we do? Pretend he said nothing?

Well what kind of skating fans would we be if we did that.

 

[Interspectator]

It's disappointing that Mishin made such an unnecessary comment. Liza's skating and her 3A are strong enough to stand on their own.
I will cheer for both Mao and Liza in the up coming season. I'd love for both of them to continue landing gorgeous 3As.

Liza and Mao, at the highest level of skill, are inverted images of each other.

Mao's Skating and footwork and transitions and spins are the best, her jumps are pretty good.
Liza's Jump rotation, quality and consistency are the best, her skating and footwork, transitions and spins are pretty good.

 

[hurrah]

Partial translation of an article written by a journalist about Mao's comeback:

Neither Mao nor anyone else yet knows the moment when she will make her comeback, and there are no guarantees in terms of the results that she will achieve. But the one certainty is that many of us will watch Asada Mao's return to competitive ice not because we are interested in her placement, but because it will be a rare opportunity for us to have a glimpse of how she herself lives her life. As a skater who has already gifted us with so many awe-inspiring performances, and now having fully reached maturity, she will undoubtedly allow us a view of her true nature as the quintessential skater. On the ice, she will, we trust, show us the extraordinary love that she has had for this sport.

　どのタイミングで復帰戦となるのか、そこでどのような結果になるのか、それは本人にも誰にもわからない。だが1つ確かなのは、浅田真央が再び競技の氷の上に立ったとき、多くの人々が求めるものは、順位よりも彼女の生き様を氷の上で見せてくれることに違いないということだ。
　これまで数多くの心に残るプログラムを見せてきた彼女だからこそ、円熟しきった現在、浅田真央というスケーターの真髄を見せてくれるに違いない。そして彼女がどれほどこのスポーツを愛してきたのかを、氷の上で表現してくれるだろう。

http://number.bunshun.jp/articles/-/823374?page=2

 

[kiara_bleu]

Well, obviously he's speaking to politic for his own skater (like every coach does). But I've actually been thinking about this for a while, though I actually went back to look this time. Why exactly is Mao's 3A on that hazy 1/4-1/8 line? Everything else about the jump looks great.

Forgive me if I'm misunderstanding you, but are you implying we should not discuss something because it would lead to greater scrutiny for Mao/better results for Mishin? Tech specialists have always looked closely at Mao's jumps. I fail to see why we should eliminate the topic (it's not like that would do her any good).

Oh no, I'm not saying that Mao or any other skaters should be free of scrutiny be it from fans, media, or even other skaters and coaches. All I am saying is that Mishin could have chosen to speak of this issue in many different ways but chose to do it using hyperbole, he "has never seen Mao do a clean triple axel". You don't say things like that without knowing you will be getting attention/reaction. That's sports, it's all part of the game...a form of trash talking. If this was basketball it's the equivalent of a coach publicly accusing players of the rival team of flopping (players pretending they are getting fouled to get free throws) to try to sway referees officiating the game.

 

[solani]

I still think that this discussion is exaggerated.
Mishin made a statement on Mao's 3A, saying it was an "illusion". And I guess that he doesn't like her take-off. So from Mishin's viewpoint, it isn't executed as it is supposed to be executed. He wouldn't teach his students to execute a 3A that way. That's his opinion and the tech panels will have a different opinion, because (I hope I remember correctly) Mao always got credit for her 3A when the landing was clean. And Elizaveta might have the more reliable technique, but we'll see that next season. But this whole article is too short. A good interviewer would've asked further.
And I'll also enjoy watching both ladies doing a 3A next season.

 

[hurrah]

Mishin made a statement on Mao's 3A, saying it was an "illusion". And I guess that he doesn't like her take-off.

As a pristine technician, I suppose Mishin thinks Liza's 3A is an illusion also because Liza's rotations aren't tight enough to even call them rotations, and her landing position is so poor that it can't even be called a landing. So I guess Liza hasn't done a 3A either.

 

[urara]

Outrageous. This is not a comment from a first-class coach.
At the same time, why icenetwork tweeted only about this, though Mishin talked about other stuff related to Mao?
Basically, this is an article in Russian. But now the discussed part is spread more by tweeting in English. I'm wondering what icenetwork's intent is as well.　
I am too suspicious though
I hate people who diss other skaters to lift up skaters you love.

 

[plushyfan]

Am I the only one not surprised by this whole Mishin thing? Although I admit I didn't quite see anyone actually questioning Mao doing CLEAN triple axels EVER but I knew he or someone in the Russian contingent was going to start comparing Liza and Mao's triple axels (and other jumps). This is politicking at its finest and the Russians probably do it the best. I mean they don't even pull any punches when squabbling amongst themselves in the rival skating clubs in Russia. Now that Russia has a legitimate chance to dominate ladies figure skating, you will see comments along these lines especially if Mao comes back strong.

Prediction: No matter what Mao's programs will be, you're also probably going to hear comments along the lines of "her skating is old fashioned" and "she doesn't bring anything new".

Fasten your seat belts, kids. This is what a real superpower federation and politicking looks like.

I remember what the western media began to say about Plushenko before Vancouver... Mishin said that was "an information war" against Plushenko. Maybe Mishin learned something. But I hope Mishin will be asked about this sentence, where he can explain his words. Mishin was always a supporter of Mao.