A reason to love COP — both programs matter.
2017 Worlds Free Dance
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A reason to love COP — both programs matter.
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2007
I have felt the same. I've been anticipating the slow climb of scores for B & S ever since the doping thing ended. I remember the rise in scores for the Russian ladies Pre-Sochi that didn't seem to match their performances.
I resurfaced just to say I love this idea. I am no huge G/P fan but I loved, loved, loved that program. So different yet engaging, I was hypnotized by it (no joke) and it was never skated to its potential. Would love to see it back.
I feel bad for W/P but unfortunately when you enter the ice dance discipline you know that your talent isn't all you are being marked on. It's been that way forever.
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2007
Yes! Repeat as often as necessary. To paraphrase Dick Button - you can skate the minute waltz in a minute but the goal should be to skate it with elegance and style (especially as a dancer).
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2007
I loved that program too! It echoed a great free program of Tracy Wilson & Rob McCall from 1984 Olympics. I always wondered why more couples didn't go this route as both programs are mesmerizing.
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2014
I was in Helsinki and it has been quite an overwhelming experience (way too many things to do in less than 4 days!). For that reason I haven't been a lot on Goldenskate nor I followed news a lot, but do we know if Scott has/had some minor physical issue? This morning he got out of the ice during practice at a certain point and then he got back and he was like touching his leg (the left one I think but I don't remember well). I didn't think it was something serious, but that "fall" looked really weird, so it got me thinking.
- Joined
- Jan 29, 2015
To make it even worse, H/D had all L4s(the only ones to get a L4 on the CiSt/SeSt Sequence) before the total twizzle disaster and partial steps disaster(Zach was super messy on the DiSt, which must've dropped it to L2). So gutted for them, hopefully it will be one of those situations that will make them stronger for the next season.
I'm still not over H/D twizzle disaster. This is the 3rd time I can remember Zach making an error cause he angles his skate down on the toe pick. I don't understand why he does this. The bronze was yours. Siiiigghhhhh. The Tyra "we were all rooting for you" gif is so appropriate for this. 
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- Joined
- Aug 12, 2014
I'm so happy for Gabriella and Guillaume. They put out their best FD after developing it all year, coming through with the artistry, the emotional resonance, the musical and storyline meaning, and the technical brilliance that sets them apart from everyone else, and I mean everyone else. It all came together for them, and I'm so happy about that. I agree with others that it may be better for them next year not to go in as 3-time straight world champions.
But, on another front ...I wish I could feel differently or at least see both sides, but I, er, have trouble with that. I've never thought there was much fairness in an Olympic gold medalist returning so they can win another gold medal. I wasn't really following FS, but even so I felt that way retrospectively as far back as Katarina Witt in 1988. You've reached the pinnacle, why do you need another one? (I know, the thrill of competition, of high achievement...) If anyone has information or an argument for me, I'd welcome the chance to hear it.
Now, I believe Sandra Bezic when she said that Tessa and Scott have come back because they want to be better artists, and that competition is the way they're able to push themselves. At least I definitely believe it about Tessa. I can't quite shake the suspicion that Scott wants to prove once and for all that he can win more than Charlie White. Well, he's proved it now. V/M are three-time world champs. ***
And if the reason to come back is to become better artists, I think they've achieved it. In a spirit of generosity, why not now give other world-class skaters a chance, not to mention their teammates, Weaver and Poje? I know it's tough to have poured all your love and effort into a sport and then be at the peak in your twenties and then have to figure out how to move on. It would have been gallant, in addition to being probably a harder path.
*** footnote: I so respect Meryl and Charlie for being able to let go of that rivalry and create other lives for themselves, but it can't have been easy.)
But, on another front ...I wish I could feel differently or at least see both sides, but I, er, have trouble with that. I've never thought there was much fairness in an Olympic gold medalist returning so they can win another gold medal. I wasn't really following FS, but even so I felt that way retrospectively as far back as Katarina Witt in 1988. You've reached the pinnacle, why do you need another one? (I know, the thrill of competition, of high achievement...) If anyone has information or an argument for me, I'd welcome the chance to hear it.
Now, I believe Sandra Bezic when she said that Tessa and Scott have come back because they want to be better artists, and that competition is the way they're able to push themselves. At least I definitely believe it about Tessa. I can't quite shake the suspicion that Scott wants to prove once and for all that he can win more than Charlie White. Well, he's proved it now. V/M are three-time world champs. ***
And if the reason to come back is to become better artists, I think they've achieved it. In a spirit of generosity, why not now give other world-class skaters a chance, not to mention their teammates, Weaver and Poje? I know it's tough to have poured all your love and effort into a sport and then be at the peak in your twenties and then have to figure out how to move on. It would have been gallant, in addition to being probably a harder path.
*** footnote: I so respect Meryl and Charlie for being able to let go of that rivalry and create other lives for themselves, but it can't have been easy.)
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2012
well...where to start, I'd say
in all honesty, I'm feeling both underwhelmed and overwhelmed at the same time after watching FD, and the the sad fact about it is that being overwhelmed is caused by so much underwhelming things from both skaters and judges. After all - I do think that all so-called/classified 'top teams' learned their lessons, and mostly in a hard or not so pleasant way.
first of all - congratulaions to Gabriella and Guillaume for performance and the way they made it, scores and winning FD aside. I could not be a die-hard fan of the program to see and feel a magnetic pull and amount of energy created by performance of it put today together. They did what they're known and famous for - stepped on ice and focused on themselves, blending together within music, story and movement in the process, as their forte is to create an impression, a personally painted canvas consisting not of paintbrush strokes, colors, but of moves, gestures and emotions conveyed. There was fluidity and flow, much needed for this kind of program and emotional projecting blended with technical ease and exquisiteness was spot on today. For me personally,it was painfully obvious how comfortable and at ease they felt with that program, that music in contrast with yesterday's SD - it's almost like having a brand new pair of shoes, looking amazing and fitting to the costume, but feeling uncomfortable in them, at the same time having this pair of broke-in shoes you are feeling like walking on air. They sure stole the momentum of the competition and even though winning 'only' silver medal there, they won a lot more - aside of FD segment - in more sense than just one.
Regarding Tessa and Scott - big respect for carrying out the performance until the end and sealing the deal, but somehow I have a feeling that they are less than pleased by the way they did it...Still loved the intimacy, rawness and level of emotional exposure of that dance, creating a personal space by movement, but sharing it externally at the same time and it takes an absolute top level competitors to not falter under circumstances happening during performance and get the job done. I know this will sound silly, but I felt when they stepped on ice and set themselves for the opening pose that there was too much of thinking and letting that result of French team penetrate in their heads, it was particularly visible for me on Tessa's expression. They did won the title, but momentum was lost and attention stolen.
Saying all above, I do think that both teams were taught some important lessons there in Helsinki and we'll see if and how they will implement it next season. For Gabriella and Guillaume - how important is SD as a segment and material done here, for Tessa and Scott - how important is to channel their focus in a right way and not to lose cool head in the process. And both teams were there already, with same lessons taught, but the next season is an Olympic one, so...
Personally - as judges really went into fantasyland a bit too long and played PCS medals game too hard - myself, I'd have Kaitlyn and Andrew or Piper and Paul as bronze medalists. Two really bright strikes of performance, strongly resonating within me. Great, vivd expression, so in character, smoothness and emotional level I like - not too much, just enough. And both programs loved by me to death, yeah I know I'm not objective. For all offended about me placing Piper/Paul on 3rd place - I don't think they were the best, they just caused the strongest influence, impression and pull to me (same goes to WeaPo in those departments) in a sea of solid, but a bit bland prformances today. And WeaPo were smooth and fluid af comparing to other teams, loved all those little touches/additions since 4CC. For WeaPo - I think that they share a similar trajectory with Madison and Evan (big sadness over tech and twizzles...) for last 3 seasons now - bit up, then bit down, then finishing either as winners or left behind. What I think is needed for them is building a constant line from today about their 'credibility' as competitors and performers (which was done for last few seasons by Maia and Alex in a very successful way), and by that they have to get etched into judges' minds as real contenders, since this season proved that with no solid backing from your record you can fall from grace as easily as you earner your stripes and titles.
As for hot topic of Ekaterina and Dimitri - my take is that I do see their qualities and allure, but the material this year was less than convincing,hence that disonant feeling about them placing 3rd in FD. Immediately, I wondered what it would be if they kept 'Anna Karenina' FD absolute masterpiece, highlighting their best assets and having a magnetic pull to the crowd, as I saw how vividly the audience today reacted to Anna and Luca doing 'same old, same old' stuff, yet still doing its magic in terms of impression over crowd. And for me, 'Anna Karenina' channelled all this 'Russian drama' embodied by Ekaterina/Dimitri in the best way possible, instead of looking just plain confusing for casual viewer as it was with their current FD. Wish they would just capitalize on their storytelling abilities instead of experimenting too much, but it's just my feeling as I was heavily attached to 'Anna Karenina' brilliance last season.
and Maia and Alex, strong performance, did its work, yet somewhat restrained and nowhere near brilliance and magnitude of 4CC one, unfortunately. And I called that lift as too long just after they did it because of missing the music a bit and making little adjustment on the run. Saying that, they delivered what they had to deliver, while other 2 US teams crumbled significantly after very successful SD - it shows how steady, solid and valuable competitors Shibutanis are. And I still adore that FD, because when 'Fix you' opened my eyes on them in a new way, 'Evolution' really kept my attention and interest.
Not an avid supporter/fan of them, but boy - it was hearbreaking to see Madison and Zach in K'n'C after that FD...After all happened it was really their to grab that brozne medal and this meldown occured. I just wish for a strong and quick regroup for them and re-focus on what's next than dwelling on that failure, but I do sense that this will a hard fro a while to pass for Zach...
in all honesty, I'm feeling both underwhelmed and overwhelmed at the same time after watching FD, and the the sad fact about it is that being overwhelmed is caused by so much underwhelming things from both skaters and judges. After all - I do think that all so-called/classified 'top teams' learned their lessons, and mostly in a hard or not so pleasant way.
first of all - congratulaions to Gabriella and Guillaume for performance and the way they made it, scores and winning FD aside. I could not be a die-hard fan of the program to see and feel a magnetic pull and amount of energy created by performance of it put today together. They did what they're known and famous for - stepped on ice and focused on themselves, blending together within music, story and movement in the process, as their forte is to create an impression, a personally painted canvas consisting not of paintbrush strokes, colors, but of moves, gestures and emotions conveyed. There was fluidity and flow, much needed for this kind of program and emotional projecting blended with technical ease and exquisiteness was spot on today. For me personally,it was painfully obvious how comfortable and at ease they felt with that program, that music in contrast with yesterday's SD - it's almost like having a brand new pair of shoes, looking amazing and fitting to the costume, but feeling uncomfortable in them, at the same time having this pair of broke-in shoes you are feeling like walking on air. They sure stole the momentum of the competition and even though winning 'only' silver medal there, they won a lot more - aside of FD segment - in more sense than just one.
Regarding Tessa and Scott - big respect for carrying out the performance until the end and sealing the deal, but somehow I have a feeling that they are less than pleased by the way they did it...Still loved the intimacy, rawness and level of emotional exposure of that dance, creating a personal space by movement, but sharing it externally at the same time and it takes an absolute top level competitors to not falter under circumstances happening during performance and get the job done. I know this will sound silly, but I felt when they stepped on ice and set themselves for the opening pose that there was too much of thinking and letting that result of French team penetrate in their heads, it was particularly visible for me on Tessa's expression. They did won the title, but momentum was lost and attention stolen.
Saying all above, I do think that both teams were taught some important lessons there in Helsinki and we'll see if and how they will implement it next season. For Gabriella and Guillaume - how important is SD as a segment and material done here, for Tessa and Scott - how important is to channel their focus in a right way and not to lose cool head in the process. And both teams were there already, with same lessons taught, but the next season is an Olympic one, so...
Personally - as judges really went into fantasyland a bit too long and played PCS medals game too hard - myself, I'd have Kaitlyn and Andrew or Piper and Paul as bronze medalists. Two really bright strikes of performance, strongly resonating within me. Great, vivd expression, so in character, smoothness and emotional level I like - not too much, just enough. And both programs loved by me to death, yeah I know I'm not objective. For all offended about me placing Piper/Paul on 3rd place - I don't think they were the best, they just caused the strongest influence, impression and pull to me (same goes to WeaPo in those departments) in a sea of solid, but a bit bland prformances today. And WeaPo were smooth and fluid af comparing to other teams, loved all those little touches/additions since 4CC. For WeaPo - I think that they share a similar trajectory with Madison and Evan (big sadness over tech and twizzles...) for last 3 seasons now - bit up, then bit down, then finishing either as winners or left behind. What I think is needed for them is building a constant line from today about their 'credibility' as competitors and performers (which was done for last few seasons by Maia and Alex in a very successful way), and by that they have to get etched into judges' minds as real contenders, since this season proved that with no solid backing from your record you can fall from grace as easily as you earner your stripes and titles.
As for hot topic of Ekaterina and Dimitri - my take is that I do see their qualities and allure, but the material this year was less than convincing,hence that disonant feeling about them placing 3rd in FD. Immediately, I wondered what it would be if they kept 'Anna Karenina' FD absolute masterpiece, highlighting their best assets and having a magnetic pull to the crowd, as I saw how vividly the audience today reacted to Anna and Luca doing 'same old, same old' stuff, yet still doing its magic in terms of impression over crowd. And for me, 'Anna Karenina' channelled all this 'Russian drama' embodied by Ekaterina/Dimitri in the best way possible, instead of looking just plain confusing for casual viewer as it was with their current FD. Wish they would just capitalize on their storytelling abilities instead of experimenting too much, but it's just my feeling as I was heavily attached to 'Anna Karenina' brilliance last season.
and Maia and Alex, strong performance, did its work, yet somewhat restrained and nowhere near brilliance and magnitude of 4CC one, unfortunately. And I called that lift as too long just after they did it because of missing the music a bit and making little adjustment on the run. Saying that, they delivered what they had to deliver, while other 2 US teams crumbled significantly after very successful SD - it shows how steady, solid and valuable competitors Shibutanis are. And I still adore that FD, because when 'Fix you' opened my eyes on them in a new way, 'Evolution' really kept my attention and interest.
Not an avid supporter/fan of them, but boy - it was hearbreaking to see Madison and Zach in K'n'C after that FD...After all happened it was really their to grab that brozne medal and this meldown occured. I just wish for a strong and quick regroup for them and re-focus on what's next than dwelling on that failure, but I do sense that this will a hard fro a while to pass for Zach...
I loved Tracy and Rob's program as well and thankfully found a copy of it from the Olympics to watch years ago. So ahead of its time. I think Dick and Peggy even gushed about it.
I wish ice dancers were encouraged to take more risks like these programs and be rewarded for it. I feel the same way about the Bonnie and Clyde program that Isabelle Delobel and Olivier Schoenfelder skated to, maybe not technically the best but so interesting to us non-skating viewers. I want some variety in my dance. I think technique is important but so is musical choice and interruption.
Heartbroken for Hubble/Donohue. I hope they come out of this stronger than before and give us more magical programs next year. The Eurosport commentators said they were docked for other elements as well. Were those justified? I didn't get to see the protocols yet.
But Wow what a powerful statement from Papadakis/Cizeron! This is the most enthralled I've ever felt watching this program. A daring artistic piece given life by the most gorgeous skating. And the best thing is the judges are rewarding them justly. It's good that V/M did not coast to a FD victory relying on reputation judging. I hope P/C work hard and smartly on their SD in the off season and come back strong from the get-go for the Olympics.
ETA best costumes: Weaver Poje, with Weaver's dress the best of the entire field.
Honorable mentions: Stepanova/Bukin, simple, contemporary with enough contrast to be striking. Especially love the open shirt look for him.
Hubbel/Donohue, love that color tone as a whole and the single cut top on him. Muted elegance.
Not a fan of P/C's "washed denim" look and although Guillaume you have a great body, I still don't think going sleeveless for male ice dancers is a good look.
And Poirier's mustache....Just no.
But Wow what a powerful statement from Papadakis/Cizeron! This is the most enthralled I've ever felt watching this program. A daring artistic piece given life by the most gorgeous skating. And the best thing is the judges are rewarding them justly. It's good that V/M did not coast to a FD victory relying on reputation judging. I hope P/C work hard and smartly on their SD in the off season and come back strong from the get-go for the Olympics.
ETA best costumes: Weaver Poje, with Weaver's dress the best of the entire field.
Honorable mentions: Stepanova/Bukin, simple, contemporary with enough contrast to be striking. Especially love the open shirt look for him.
Hubbel/Donohue, love that color tone as a whole and the single cut top on him. Muted elegance.
Not a fan of P/C's "washed denim" look and although Guillaume you have a great body, I still don't think going sleeveless for male ice dancers is a good look.
And Poirier's mustache....Just no.
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- Joined
- Mar 7, 2011
I thought they were living together
Sigh. I was thinking this as well. There must be a Russian on the dance podium and also true about '14 Russian ladies.
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2014
May I disagree with this? Tessa and Scott were absolutely mesmerising even with the freak accident.
Gabriella and Guillaume finally delivered that FD to their fullest potential, and I didn't like it during the season, while now I think it was the best FD of the year material-wise. It took a lot of time to get it up there, but IMHO it was worth it. Tessa and Scott's FD really showcases their long flowing edges, but I think it didn't grow enough during the season.
Maia and Alex weren't that great in the SD, but the free dance was REALLY something. I enjoyed it a lot and the audience appreciated it as much (if not more) than Gabi and Guillaume's one.
To me they were the clear medallists and without a doubt in that order (taking into account SD as well)
- Joined
- Apr 1, 2017
They do it out of love for sport and personal glory. And both are very valid motives. Why would they have to stop doing what they love to give other athletes a chance? For example, no one asked Usain Bolt or Michael Phelps to leave their sport, no one asks Serena Williams and Roger Federer to retire just in order to give a chance to younger players, and they have been dominating their sports for much more time than V/M. Why do it with Tessa and Scott? In my opinion, it makes no sense, and it's extremely unfair from our part (fans) to tell someone when to go away.
Well, Scott is Tessa's lifelong partner, there would be no one else with whom she would return to the sport. I agree that Tessa does so genuinely for developing her artistic side more. Scott does it because Tessa is doing it and who would say no to the possibility of returning to something you like having more experience and a better perspective? I doubt his mentality is focused on overcoming Charlie, and even if he does, I don't think that's the biggest reason for his return, maybe, I don't know, he just simply loves this sport.
I wonder if there was this much gripe about "fairness" when Yuna came back for her second gold in Sochi. Or do you only mean if skaters have completely retired? I personally think more props if you can retire for a few years and still be the class of the field.
- Joined
- Jan 4, 2016
I've been there! It wasn't until last year when I was in Boston I began to like them. I don't mean during their short or free, it was when I saw their gala performance. It was fun! Their programs this year are fun too and they've FINALLY won me over!
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