2015-2016 Programs by Discipline

[Bangladesh]

I'm not sure what is Liza trying to do with her FS :scratch: The last 30 seconds work splendidly, but the first minute or so was just weird, the choreography didn't seem to have anything to do with the music at all! And the lyrics part didn't seem to suit her at all, either...

Mishin trying to do program easy to (or for?) jumps. He didn't respect transitions, which steal energy So just compare programs of his students. All choreography are made on one place, and program in general is just simple skating from element to element. Oh, yes, I forgot about flying kiss and hips moments

I'm sure it is the reason why professor didn't like Lambiel's work - tooo much unwanted moves :disapp:

 

[Rissa]

I'm not sure what is Liza trying to do with her FS :scratch: The last 30 seconds work splendidly, but the first minute or so was just weird, the choreography didn't seem to have anything to do with the music at all! And the lyrics part didn't seem to suit her at all, either...

Musically, I'm finding the first minute more interesting than the later part and with much potential for choreography. And if this is Lambiel's work, there probably was choreography for that part. The biggest problem is that the first minute doesn't mesh with the rest of the program at all. Like, whatever costume Liza chooses, it will not suit both parts, so different they are. They still have time for improvement though, maybe it'll turn out ok.

 

[cheerknithanson]

Why do they bother employing choreographers if they are going to change everything anyway? I am genuinely confused by the thought process here.

We do the same in cheerleading with choreographers. We do it to get initial layouts of routines and if we need to make changes as we go, we do it. The part where it changes for us is the dance portion usually.

Unless you were being totally sarcastic in this post....

 

[Rissa]

We do the same in cheerleading with choreographers. We do it to get initial layouts of routines and if we need to make changes as we go, we do it. The part where it changes for us is the dance portion usually.

Unless you were being totally sarcastic in this post....

Do cheeleaders get marked on choreography, though? (genuine question, in my country cheerleaders practically don't exist.) Because I don't think those snake-y bolero movements with that music are going to earn Liza much presentation points. If Liza and her team discard good choreography, 3A isn't going to be enough to win over Mao who will beat her on PCS soundly.

 

[Meoima]

I'm sure it is the reason why professor didn't like Lambiel's work - tooo much unwanted moves :disapp:

The music cuts are not that ideal to me. I mean if it were me I would use mostly Hall of the mountain king for her. The slow part I'd rather use Morning Mood. No Solveig's song at all because it doesn't suit her.

 

[WeakAnkles]

I'm not sure what is Liza trying to do with her FS :scratch: The last 30 seconds work splendidly, but the first minute or so was just weird, the choreography didn't seem to have anything to do with the music at all! And the lyrics part didn't seem to suit her at all, either...

There was choreography in that? I sure didn't see any.

Well the music cuts are atrocious, without even the camp appeal of Bolero and the exoticism of last year's LP. It's a total mismatch of music and skater. YMMV.

And yes, I'm a fan of Liza's. But no one would ever accuse her of being a particularly musical skater and that music demands interpretative ability that she simply does not have.

 

[Bangladesh]

The music cuts are not that ideal to me. I mean if it were me I would use mostly Hall of the mountain king for her. The slow part I'd rather use Morning Mood. No Solveig's song at all because it doesn't suit her.

Her coach don't think that way. Mishin actualy don't care suit music to Liza or don't. The music cuts are perfect to she can do two 3axels successfully in first part and recognizable last part help Liza finish her program on higt note (even if she will fail all her elements). In some way music choise is absolutely good.

 

[invisiblespiral]

I liked the first section of Liza's FS.... and then started getting bored. I still think this is my favorite program of hers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=y4fv9o3M8oo

 

[silverfoxes]

Didn't Alexander Petrov already skated to this music? Or someone else?

Many people have used it...last season off the top of my head, Alaine Chartrand and Ivan Pavlov. And Alena Leonova skated to it in the past. I don't mind it too much, although parts of it make me think of those old Mantovani/101 Strings Orchestra albums that are collecting dust now in thrift shops. A little "muzak"-y. I like Liza's music better, but it's clear that no matter what she does, people will complain about it.

 

[LuisRollerArg]

I think this one of the worst FS from Liza, so dissapointed for this, specially if this was made for Lambiel, I still think her best program was the Malaguena..

 

[OS]

I did worry about Liza's artistry being staunched under Mishin that seems only ever to value tech above all else. In any case I doubt her team care when she can 3T3T+ tano to the top for majority of the season despite a B- rated program (Did she blew kisses to the judges again in that choreography? hip wiggling again? Seriously?! Might as well add a see through lingerie 'costume' now and become a cliche of all cliches, along with dramatic dying on ice).

It may ends up like a game of 'chicken' with Mao. If one don't do the 3A, the other won't. If the other one does, then the other one will. If Mao proved her strong PCS can win competitions, then Liza's 3A will come on to the scene much earlier. Although no jump including a 3A or quad make a program, in the ladies field the 3A and especially with the new +0.44 value added for 3T3T, or +0.22 added for 2A3T in base value in the 2nd half, can wipe out any differences. A matter of minimum 4 tech points can more than overcome any poor choreography (When PCS scoring wise it is usally a matter of 1.5 points swing difference range of 7.5-9, add mean average, really is only approx 0.75 in the end depends on competition, home field advantage, and judging panel make up.) 3A< = a 3lz scoring wise. So very little risk.

It will be fun to to see if 'some' judges award PCS in high 8s/ 9s for things like Choreography, then I know there's no hope for PCS and honesty in this sport and that anonymity MUST BE REMOVED along with Speedy and his same old Cronies that have been in power for too long it inevitably corrupts.

 

[Meoima]

Her coach don't think that way. Mishin actualy don't care suit music to Liza or don't. The music cuts are perfect to she can do two 3axels successfully in first part and recognizable last part help Liza finish her program on higt note (even if she will fail all her elements). In some way music choise is absolutely good.

The music cuts are abrupt and the Solveig part doesn't suite her slow pace. It's better to use another slow part but not Solveig song.

 

[andromache]

I did worry about Liza's artistry being staunched under Mishin that seems only ever to value tech above all else. In any case I doubt her team care when she can 3T3T+ tano to the top for majority of the season despite a B- rated program (Did she blew kisses to the judges again in that choreography? hip wiggling again? Seriously?! Might as well add a see through lingerie 'costume' now and become a cliche of all cliches, along with dramatic dying on ice).

It may ends up like a game of 'chicken' with Mao. If one don't do the 3A, the other won't. If the other one does, then the other one will. If Mao proved her strong PCS can win competitions, then Liza's 3A will come on to the scene much earlier. Although no jump including a 3A or quad make a program, in the ladies field the 3A and especially with the new +0.44 value added for 3T3T, or +0.22 added for 2A3T in base value in the 2nd half, can wipe out any differences. A matter of minimum 4 tech points can more than overcome any poor choreography (When PCS scoring wise it is usally a matter of 1.5 points swing difference range of 7.5-9.) 3A< = a 3lz scoring wise. So very little risk.

It will be fun to to see if 'some' judges award PCS in high 8s/ 9s for things like Choreography, then I know there's no hope for PCS and honesty in this sport and that anonymity MUST BE REMOVED along with Speedy and his same old Cronies that have been in power for too long it inevitably corrupts.

I don't think the 3A will be a game of chicken with Mao. I would really be shocked if she doesn't bring it out in every competition for at least one program if not both. Liza is just so solid technically.

Anyway, I'm beyond disinterested in Liza's program. I don't hate the music (though the different sections are a little jarring) but it looks too much like her programs last season when she is skating to very different music. Very similar arms and other movements, and weak ones at that. I know it's early in the season, but when she's so recently visited her choreographer and in a run-through with single jumps, I would expect to see more choreography now and then perhaps expect it to be reduced throughout the season as the jumps demand it.

Liza's choreography was not great last season, but her sass gave it some life. I'm not sure how well sass will work with this music choice though. Overall, I'm disappointed that it appears as though we won't be seeing more artistic development from her this season--though I'd love for her to prove me wrong. And I have a feeling she will receive very, very high PCS regardless.

 

[Sophie-Anna]

Many people have used it...last season off the top of my head, Alaine Chartrand and Ivan Pavlov. And Alena Leonova skated to it in the past. I don't mind it too much, although parts of it make me think of those old Mantovani/101 Strings Orchestra albums that are collecting dust now in thrift shops. A little "muzak"-y. I like Liza's music better, but it's clear that no matter what she does, people will complain about it.

Thank you it was Alaine Chartrand's music last year, that's why I remember the name of it.

 

[yuki]

It may ends up like a game of 'chicken' with Mao. If one don't do the 3A, the other won't. If the other one does, then the other one will.

Won't happen. If Mao still has the 3A, she will do it no matter what Liza does.

 

[Sophie-Anna]

I did worry about Liza's artistry being staunched under Mishin that seems only ever to value tech above all else. In any case I doubt her team care when she can 3T3T+ tano to the top for majority of the season despite a B- rated program (Did she blew kisses to the judges again in that choreography? hip wiggling again? Seriously?! Might as well add a see through lingerie 'costume' now and become a cliche of all cliches, along with dramatic dying on ice).

It may ends up like a game of 'chicken' with Mao. If one don't do the 3A, the other won't. If the other one does, then the other one will. If Mao proved her strong PCS can win competitions, then Liza's 3A will come on to the scene much earlier. Although no jump including a 3A or quad make a program, in the ladies field the 3A and especially with the new +0.44 value added for 3T3T, or +0.22 added for 2A3T in base value in the 2nd half, can wipe out any differences. A matter of minimum 4 tech points can more than overcome any poor choreography (When PCS scoring wise it is usally a matter of 1.5 points swing difference range of 7.5-9.) 3A< = a 3lz scoring wise. So very little risk.

It will be fun to to see if 'some' judges award PCS in high 8s/ 9s for things like Choreography, then I know there's no hope for PCS and honesty in this sport and that anonymity MUST BE REMOVED along with Speedy and his same old Cronies that have been in power for too long it inevitably corrupts.

About anonymity, I think many people agree it should be removed(including me). And judges awarding high marks for choreography when there is not choreography, or for performance when there was 2 or 3 or more falls...It is not a new thing.It is unfortunately pretty common in figure skating. PCS are often given just for name.

 

[Spiral]

Won't happen. If Mao still has the 3A, she will do it no matter what Liza does.

Yes, and the same goes for Liza. As soon as she got 3A more or less stable, with the rest of the program intact, she started doing it this past season, even though no other lady was doing it.

 

[FSGMT]

I liked the first section of Liza's FS.... and then started getting bored. I still think this is my favorite program of hers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=y4fv9o3M8oo

THAT was an actual attempt (the only one in her whole career, maybe?) to do something different, and it even worked for me! But they obviously ditched it... Why challenge yourself when jumps is all your coach thinks you need?

 

[cheerknithanson]

Do cheeleaders get marked on choreography, though? (genuine question, in my country cheerleaders practically don't exist.) Because I don't think those snake-y bolero movements with that music are going to earn Liza much presentation points. If Liza and her team discard good choreography, 3A isn't going to be enough to win over Mao who will beat her on PCS soundly.

We do get marks on the dance section like on rhythm, synchronization (Unless we are doing ripples), energy, and formation. And motions get scored based on levels and sharp timing.

Like figure skating, we get points on the different "elements" of cheerleading: tumbling, 2-3 different types of stunts (Sequence, 1-legged, and pyramid. Sometimes another one if there's a cheer in the routine), dance, jumps (Cheerleading jumps are a whole heck of a lot easier than figure skating jumps honestly), and sometimes a cheer in it. The cheer part is not done in all-stars, but it's done in school cheer teams and some recreational cheer teams.

However, it's different because they're no set points to specific elements. Instead, they're scored on a scale based on different aspects. Like for example: Tumbling is scored based on complexity, variety, technique and also how many members of your team can tumble. Because in high school, that was where my team got beaten by the most because we barely had anyone who can do handsprings.

And also like figure skating, we can get deductions. But honestly, the deductions can be a lot harsher than figure skating. Apparently doing illegal stunts could get a deduction of 20 points. Stunts falling to the ground will get a 5 point deduction. Like one time my coaches were worried I would get a 1 point deduction for safety related appearance because my hair is so long so they put my hair in a bun instead of a ponytail. Lol.

 

[MaxSwagg]

Liza's 3A is great but she telegraphs it so much to the point where she forgoes what little choreography is there—if there's even any there at all. I don't get this wavy arm movement choreography with this music. I can get Yuzu's exaggerated arm movements throughouht his program this season because, well, that's distinctly an elemen of Seimei, but for Liza?? It's like what is going on...