2021-22 Japanese Women's Figure Skating
- Thread starter cohkaix
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it's not a secret that Wakaba is my second favourite japanese woman (the first one is Satoko), i'm so happy to see her skate an amazing short!
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I had to force myself to watch JNats after Rika withdrew. I was that disappointed as I wanted to see her at the Olympics. But now? Pfft, she dodged a bullet big time! She doesn’t want to be at this Charlie Foxtrot no way! On to 2026!
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Yes she did!!!! And thank goodness she didn't kill herself trying to limp through the GPs and JNats!!!!! I'm absolutely thrilled she sat the season out now in retrospect!!!!!
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congrats to both of these amazing girls, that btw are among my favourite skaters 
i'm sorry Mana had a meltdown but she's young and has a plenty of chances to redeem herself in the future
i'm sorry Mana had a meltdown but she's young and has a plenty of chances to redeem herself in the future
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- Mar 21, 2018
Yes, a little positivity is needed. Way to go Sakamoto on her bronze! Her joy in the medal ceremony was infectious. Higuchi also did extremely well; top 5 with a 210+ score is a great result for her. She also ended up being the only skater to land a 3A. I think it’s her first time landing the jump in both programs. From the press conferences, it actually sounds like both Sakamoto and Higuchi will continue on. I thought Sakamoto would retire, but she mentioned preparing for Worlds so I guess she plans to be there. Maybe after Worlds then?
As for Kawabe, the best is yet to come and she just needs to take this in stride. I completely agree with her selection to the Olympics team over Mihara. (I also think Malinin should’ve been at the Olympics and the situations are the same.) However, JFed definitely needs to rethink her for the Worlds team. Sakamoto and Higuchi can hold the spots down, but Mihara needs to be there as a fail-safe. All three ladies could easily place top 6, with one possibly making the podium.
As for Kawabe, the best is yet to come and she just needs to take this in stride. I completely agree with her selection to the Olympics team over Mihara. (I also think Malinin should’ve been at the Olympics and the situations are the same.) However, JFed definitely needs to rethink her for the Worlds team. Sakamoto and Higuchi can hold the spots down, but Mihara needs to be there as a fail-safe. All three ladies could easily place top 6, with one possibly making the podium.
Congratulations to Kaori for her outstanding consistency and determination. But I must say that Wakaba could easily have finished ahead of her if she wasn't judged far harsher and lowballed more than any skater in the competition. Yes, Wakaba had a fall, but she also did a combined 2 perfect 3As along with 3 3/3 combos compared to 2 3/3s and no 3As for Sakamoto. I think several of the calls on Higuchi were bogus and she should have been at least 2 or 3 points ahead of Kaori at the end.
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- Mar 9, 2013
Re. Kaori vs. Wakaba
First of all, I'm absolutely satisfied and happy for Kaori's bronze medal, and Wakaba's 2 3As success in the competitions.
To be honest, I don't see the point to compare the two anymore, as both reached their goals in this Olympics. For me, the difference is only in their strategies and approach: yes, Kaori doesn't have more difficult jumps, she and her team are aware of that. So the only way to compensate for the shortage was to ensure every little details and levels could be achieved (including the flutz problem), plus the consistency and security in her jumps. On the other hand, Wakaba is more close to mastering the 3A. So she may choose to focus on that. But by putting the 3A jump and a cleanly skated program into priority, at the same time she let go the chances to hold other elements to a better level.
There's nothing wrong with either of the choices, just different outcomes for the moment.
I'm still thrilled that both girls also clearly state for continuation in the sport. I want to see Wakaba keeping her 3A, but refine her other jumps (such as pushing for difficult combinations in the later half of the program). And Kaori, she just said in the press conference what she still wants to master other more difficult jumps.
It felt like a long journey to follow both Kaori and Wakaba, as I was able to watch both live in competitions (different ones) since they were at the jr. level. And I'm really glad both achieved so much throughout the years.
My final words for @Joekaz, I really don't get why you insist on promoting Wakaba while demoting Kaori, instead of questioning, e.g. why Wakaba was getting lower PCS comparing to the Russian girls (Wakaba's 69.26 vs. Kamila's 70.62 or Sasha's 70.97?). [And yes, I know your potential answer...blame everything on JSF!
]
First of all, I'm absolutely satisfied and happy for Kaori's bronze medal, and Wakaba's 2 3As success in the competitions.
To be honest, I don't see the point to compare the two anymore, as both reached their goals in this Olympics. For me, the difference is only in their strategies and approach: yes, Kaori doesn't have more difficult jumps, she and her team are aware of that. So the only way to compensate for the shortage was to ensure every little details and levels could be achieved (including the flutz problem), plus the consistency and security in her jumps. On the other hand, Wakaba is more close to mastering the 3A. So she may choose to focus on that. But by putting the 3A jump and a cleanly skated program into priority, at the same time she let go the chances to hold other elements to a better level.
There's nothing wrong with either of the choices, just different outcomes for the moment.
I'm still thrilled that both girls also clearly state for continuation in the sport. I want to see Wakaba keeping her 3A, but refine her other jumps (such as pushing for difficult combinations in the later half of the program). And Kaori, she just said in the press conference what she still wants to master other more difficult jumps.
It felt like a long journey to follow both Kaori and Wakaba, as I was able to watch both live in competitions (different ones) since they were at the jr. level. And I'm really glad both achieved so much throughout the years.
My final words for @Joekaz, I really don't get why you insist on promoting Wakaba while demoting Kaori, instead of questioning, e.g. why Wakaba was getting lower PCS comparing to the Russian girls (Wakaba's 69.26 vs. Kamila's 70.62 or Sasha's 70.97?). [And yes, I know your potential answer...blame everything on JSF!
]
I love the enthusiasm of Kaori of learning more difficult jumps. If she got a 4 in the one spin she got a 3 in, in the free skate, she could have scored 234 instead of 233, like Japanese Nationals. So, there is a bit more room for improvement for her in the international sceneRe. Kaori vs. Wakaba
First of all, I'm absolutely satisfied and happy for Kaori's bronze medal, and Wakaba's 2 3As success in the competitions.
To be honest, I don't see the point to compare the two anymore, as both reached their goals in this Olympics. For me, the difference is only in their strategies and approach: yes, Kaori doesn't have more difficult jumps, she and her team are aware of that. So the only way to compensate for the shortage was to ensure every little details and levels could be achieved (including the flutz problem), plus the consistency and security in her jumps. On the other hand, Wakaba is more close to mastering the 3A. So she may choose to focus on that. But by putting the 3A jump and a cleanly skated program into priority, at the same time she let go the chances to hold other elements to a better level.
There's nothing wrong with either of the choices, just different outcomes for the moment.
I'm still thrilled that both girls also clearly state for continuation in the sport. I want to see Wakaba keeping her 3A, but refine her other jumps (such as pushing for difficult combinations in the later half of the program). And Kaori, she just said in the press conference what she still wants to master other more difficult jumps.
It felt like a long journey to follow both Kaori and Wakaba, as I was able to watch both live in competitions (different ones) since they were at the jr. level. And I'm really glad both achieved so much throughout the years.
My final words for @Joekaz, I really don't get why you insist on promoting Wakaba while demoting Kaori, instead of questioning, e.g. why Wakaba was getting lower PCS comparing to the Russian girls (Wakaba's 69.26 vs. Kamila's 70.62 or Sasha's 70.97?). [And yes, I know your potential answer...blame everything on JSF!
I suggest Kaori needs to learn from Wakaba and Wakaba needs to learn from Kaori.
Kaori needs to try to go for the 3A, like Wakaba. I know when she tried, in the past she fell on a 3A at q in a practice video I saw. But, I saw potential. If she learns this jump and puts in a 3A in SP and one in LP, that jump alone could get her to 245
(not even allowing for increase of PCS due to increase of technical difficulty). Anna Scherbackova and Alexandra Trusova only surpassed this score once, internationally, in three years, at the Olympics. That is encouraging for skaters like Kaori. They can still be competitive. She just needs to learn and focus on one ultra-c jump. Her 2A is outstanding and I just see a 3A there.On the other hand, Wakaba. Good job on mastering that 3A. Both were landed beautifully here. You have the hard jump Kaori is missing. You are in a good spot. But, then, the rest of program is lacking. She lacks height in the 3T after the 3Lz and she needs more speed and a bit higher jumps. But, she has the ultra-c jump. So, just look at Kaori for the rest of the jumps and try a similar layout. Good job Wakaba! So much potential.
With all this being said. I worry about Wakaba not landing her 3A’s at Worlds. I really want Japan to get three slots and I have no faith in Kawabe. I really hope Japanese federation will add Mai for Worlds, just to secure the three slots so I can see the maximum amount of Japanese skaters at Worlds next year. But, I know this is already set in stone. So, I hope Mana can have a redemption performance at Worlds.
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- Mar 9, 2013
Kaori did mention attempting quads and voiding 3A: she said 3A jump are still 'frightening'. I know ppl are wondering why. Kaori did attempt and trained hard for 3A during her Jr. years. Because of that, she was seriously injured, and most likely that experience has been keeping her away from the big jump (another saying I get is that it even delayed her moving from jr. to sr level for the whole year).
What part of my statement demotes Kaori? I congratulated her and praised her. I just simply pointed out the fact that although Wakaba wasn't as clean as Kaori, her tougher programs provided her with enough points to beat Kaori if she wasn't judged so much harsher. I don't see anything outrageous in that.Re. Kaori vs. Wakaba
First of all, I'm absolutely satisfied and happy for Kaori's bronze medal, and Wakaba's 2 3As success in the competitions.
To be honest, I don't see the point to compare the two anymore, as both reached their goals in this Olympics. For me, the difference is only in their strategies and approach: yes, Kaori doesn't have more difficult jumps, she and her team are aware of that. So the only way to compensate for the shortage was to ensure every little details and levels could be achieved (including the flutz problem), plus the consistency and security in her jumps. On the other hand, Wakaba is more close to mastering the 3A. So she may choose to focus on that. But by putting the 3A jump and a cleanly skated program into priority, at the same time she let go the chances to hold other elements to a better level.
There's nothing wrong with either of the choices, just different outcomes for the moment.
I'm still thrilled that both girls also clearly state for continuation in the sport. I want to see Wakaba keeping her 3A, but refine her other jumps (such as pushing for difficult combinations in the later half of the program). And Kaori, she just said in the press conference what she still wants to master other more difficult jumps.
It felt like a long journey to follow both Kaori and Wakaba, as I was able to watch both live in competitions (different ones) since they were at the jr. level. And I'm really glad both achieved so much throughout the years.
My final words for @Joekaz, I really don't get why you insist on promoting Wakaba while demoting Kaori, instead of questioning, e.g. why Wakaba was getting lower PCS comparing to the Russian girls (Wakaba's 69.26 vs. Kamila's 70.62 or Sasha's 70.97?). [And yes, I know your potential answer...blame everything on JSF!
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Kaori doesn't rotate fast enough to do a 3A. And Kaori relies more on speed to jump out, instead of jumping ability to jump up like Wakaba or Midori. That extra speed would indeed make a 3A very dangerous for Kaori.
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The problem with Wakaba's 3T in the combo is that her lutz is so high and vertical, while very impressive, makes it hard to carry speed into the 3T. She is a more traditional big jumper than Sakamoto, who jumps more out. That's why usually Kaori jumps longer, but Wakaba jumps a little higher, depending on the jump.I love the enthusiasm of Kaori of learning more difficult jumps. If she got a 4 in the one spin she got a 3 in, in the free skate, she could have scored 234 instead of 233, like Japanese Nationals. So, there is a bit more room for improvement for her in the international scene
I suggest Kaori needs to learn from Wakaba and Wakaba needs to learn from Kaori.
Kaori needs to try to go for the 3A, like Wakaba. I know when she tried, in the past she fell on a 3A at q in a practice video I saw. But, I saw potential. If she learns this jump and puts in a 3A in SP and one in LP, that jump alone could get her to 245
On the other hand, Wakaba. Good job on mastering that 3A. Both were landed beautifully here. You have the hard jump Kaori is missing. You are in a good spot. But, then, the rest of program is lacking. She lacks height in the 3T after the 3Lz and she needs more speed and a bit higher jumps. But, she has the ultra-c jump. So, just look at Kaori for the rest of the jumps and try a similar layout. Good job Wakaba! So much potential.
With all this being said. I worry about Wakaba not landing her 3A’s at Worlds. I really want Japan to get three slots and I have no faith in Kawabe. I really hope Japanese federation will add Mai for Worlds, just to secure the three slots so I can see the maximum amount of Japanese skaters at Worlds next year. But, I know this is already set in stone. So, I hope Mana can have a redemption performance at Worlds.
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- Mar 5, 2014
I enjoyed Kaori's fast speed and flow and Wakaba's fabulous triple axel and impressive commitment to really go for all her elements, but I am heartbroken for Mana. I really have enjoyed a number of her performances and I sincerely hope she is able to make it back and become even better. I think the best way to nurture Mana's development and make Japan's three places for Worlds more secure is to send Mai Mihara to Worlds especially since Mana is 6 years younger than Mai and will probably benefit from some time to recover and hone her skills. What's more Mai has certainly earned the right to be there with an average of 215+ over three international competitions and a 4CC championship win this season. I can see no reason beyond blatant bias against Mai and the need to appease the powerful Coach Hamada for not sending Mai to Worlds, and as I said I don't think it helps Mana's future development either to have so much pressure on her to fill the scoring shoes of Mai at such a young age after what just happened at the Olympics. Even though Young You and Wakaba skated really well at the Olympics, to be honest they were two of my favorites, they still couldn't reach Mai's highest scores this season. The JSF is more biased against Mai than the ISU international scoring and that is an amazing realization since Mai was held down so she wouldn't medal at her two Grand Prix events.
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Mai was supported all year, but made huge mistakes that cost her at Nats. Removing Mana would be the worst thing you could do for her now. She needs to get right back on that horse.
Kaori's bronze performance reminded me kind of Arakawa's Olympic performance. Both were solid without taking unnecessary risks and let their opponents implode. I was also reminded of how one year ago at World's Kaori skated about the same with probably a better program, but was ridiculously fifth behind Chen,when the US needed to secure 3 spots. The way she was judged there reminded me of Wakaba here. Very strict tech calls for her, but lenient for Chen. Lowballed on GOE and PCS. Almost as if the judges are not honest. Lol I was also curious if Rika returns healthy next season, would she still be able to beat Kaori, with the way Sakamoto seems to being scored now?
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I am very happy about how this olys went from many angles. 
Wakaba landing her 3As, Wakaba and Kaori having so much fun together, Kaori pulling off fully clean programs (she never has meltdown skates, but she pops sometimes, UGH), and of course, the bronze!!! Of course, we all wish Mana could have had better skates (she's such a lovely skater when she hits) and Wakaba could also have gone fully clean (that Lion King program was awe-inspiring at IdF), but, alas, can't have them all. Mana still has time - I have faith that she'll be able to continue to develop. I have hopes for Kaori and Wakaba at Worlds as well (SURELY we can't see a repeat of what happened in 2018... unless...)
I do agree with the above posters that Mai makes more sense for a Worlds pick. While Kaori is consistent, Wakaba unfortunately still isn't and there are just too many fantastic JP ladies around for the nation to potentially go down to 2 spots. On a sentimental level, I also feel like it'd be cruel to deny Mai a Worlds spot after the year she's had, especially since she's been getting more lenient calls this year. Of course, one can tell from my pfp that I may be a little biased, and JSF isn't exactly known for making smart decisions... but let a girl dream.
Wakaba landing her 3As, Wakaba and Kaori having so much fun together, Kaori pulling off fully clean programs (she never has meltdown skates, but she pops sometimes, UGH), and of course, the bronze!!! Of course, we all wish Mana could have had better skates (she's such a lovely skater when she hits) and Wakaba could also have gone fully clean (that Lion King program was awe-inspiring at IdF), but, alas, can't have them all. Mana still has time - I have faith that she'll be able to continue to develop. I have hopes for Kaori and Wakaba at Worlds as well (SURELY we can't see a repeat of what happened in 2018... unless...)I do agree with the above posters that Mai makes more sense for a Worlds pick. While Kaori is consistent, Wakaba unfortunately still isn't and there are just too many fantastic JP ladies around for the nation to potentially go down to 2 spots. On a sentimental level, I also feel like it'd be cruel to deny Mai a Worlds spot after the year she's had, especially since she's been getting more lenient calls this year. Of course, one can tell from my pfp that I may be a little biased, and JSF isn't exactly known for making smart decisions... but let a girl dream.
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