2022-23 US Pairs Figure Skating | Page 10 | Golden Skate

2022-23 US Pairs Figure Skating

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macy said:
i think you're misunderstanding the context of what she said. they were direct competitors trying to outdo each other, and having a competitor with that grit makes it harder for you to stay on top. i imagine she meant this in a well meaning and not negative way.
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I took it that Alexa meant it in a teasing, humorous way ... and also elevating Brandon a little, showing a bit of humility, since she and Chris usually landed higher than Haven and Brandon. [I still miss Haven😭 and her beautiful, heartfelt artistry.]


@Skate1234 :

We do need some US Pairs, so I’m glad to hear about another pairing (though i was secretly hoping that Danny and Ashley Cain would pair up).
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That would have been cool. Their mutual years of experience would have created something entirely new and intriguing, and their differences in style might have created something we've never seen before in pairs skating! My imagination is stimulated by your statement! . ( See Deanna Stellato and Maxime Deschamps interview, where they spoke briefly about the difference between adapting their differences with an experienced pair partner -- Deanna; versus always being the experienced partner who featured large in teaching a new-to-pairs, young partner the required elements. Maxime said he had 8 partners before Deanna. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4sgfoexr6g

And I do miss Ashley and Tim so much. 😭 Their artistry together and synchronicity was so wonderful.

But I'm investing my passion into other pairs: Deanna/Max for one. I'm looking more closely at Emily/Spencer and Maria/Ivan. By the way, the Skate Canada daily motion pairs coverage with Ted Barton commentating is really worth a listen. He spoke glowingly of how fast and strong Emily and Spencer are; and how amazing Maximiliano's strength and power is in lifting Valentina. Since I haven't seen either team in person, to really experience the speed, it was really enlightening.
 
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2sk8 said:
No doubt US will find a way to make this happen, though it is an odd circumstance. Ellie had to enter the NQS with Ian, and then change partners, which is allowed. The rules require that happen by date "X" (I think that is still 9/1), AND they should have had to compete in NQS to qualify for the Pairs Final & Nationals, which they obviously did not do. Exception being listed Byes, which they do not have as a new team, unless they do 3 internationals. Even then, I can only assume they were added to the ISP based solely on monitoring, and that is a benefit they would have because it is Danny. Other teams have to compete, and meet certain scores - although that was lower overall this year too due to the low number of teams. I know that last year he and Liu also did not qualify through the NQS, did not have a bye because they did not have the internationals, but were told they could compete at Nationals. Of course, that ended up being irrelevant because of that horrific fall, but USFS does make an effort to support Danny. US certainly needs the teams and they look very happy, so here's hoping it works out better than last time!
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I believe, and someone will correct me if I’m wrong, that one international assignment allows one to skip the NQS and go to Sectionals. I say let them all skate. Just let them skate. I think we only had..,,8 pairs compete last year? And 3 of them off the top of my head have retired.
 
skylark said:
I took it that Alexa meant it in a teasing, humorous way ... and also elevating Brandon a little, showing a bit of humility, since she and Chris usually landed higher than Haven and Brandon. [I still miss Haven😭 and her beautiful, heartfelt artistry.]




That would have been cool. Their mutual years of experience would have created something entirely new and intriguing, and their differences in style might have created something we've never seen before in pairs skating! My imagination is stimulated by your statement! . ( See Deanna Stellato and Maxime Deschamps interview, where they spoke briefly about the difference between adapting their differences with an experienced pair partner -- Deanna; versus always being the experienced partner who featured large in teaching a new-to-pairs, young partner the required elements. Maxime said he had 8 partners before Deanna. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4sgfoexr6g

And I do miss Ashley and Tim so much. 😭 Their artistry together and synchronicity was so wonderful.

But I'm investing my passion into other pairs: Deanna/Max for one. I'm looking more closely at Emily/Spencer and Maria/Ivan. By the way, the Skate Canada daily motion pairs coverage with Ted Barton commentating is really worth a listen. He spoke glowingly of how fast and strong Emily and Spencer are; and how amazing Maximiliano's strength and power is in lifting Valentina. Since I haven't seen either team in person, to really experience the speed, it was really enlightening.
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It would have been amazing. But she may be medically unable to skate at that level again.
 
I agree - let them all skate - and yet, in some ways, I don't agree because the decisions about who is going to get to skate and have opportunities are not made on a level playing field. Much of it is committee policy, that can be changed at a moment's notice, v. actual rules, and those "policies" are not really applied equally. That is just reality in this sport.

You are correct that one international assignment, from a select list, can grant a bye from NQS. But, it is also true that the Bye Criteria say that "Additionally, all are highly encouraged to participate in the National Qualifying Series via an approved NQS competition." Since ALL of the NQS are long over before Danny & Ellie even announced their partnership, discussions with TPTB must have made it quite clear they would be given whatever assignment was needed to advance on the Nationals. Else, how would they conclude there was no need to skate in any NQS? I know - from the horses' mouths - a similar accomodation was made last year. And, how would they get an international assignment with absolutely no competition score posted, and therefore none at the supposed level that is required to be assigned to an international (although that was de facto reduced this year due to the paucity of pairs)? And, not even added to ISP yet?

If you wanted to compete during the season, it is a very risky move to not compete in the NQS without a clear bye in place. The same thing happened to Danny & Chelsea last year, and it became a moot issue only due to their horrific fall. Thus, logic says they knew they were being given a bye without competing up front, and that is simply not an option for most new teams.

Great for Danny, but maybe not so great for others looking at whether the effort is worth their while. Maybe there would be more pairs if ... well, I guess I think this approach is not so clear cut.

As for the 8 pairs last year, there were a number of withdrawals due to Covid so hopefully that is not a repeat. And, some that moved on were given the message they would not be given competitive opportunities like this without meeting criteria that are adjustable for others. Of course, this reduces the number of teams.

I guess, in a nutshell, I'm happy for Danny but think the management of pairs in the US blatantly S&*#* and does not encourage more pairs to let them all skate. JMHO based on a lot of actual experience :)
 
I do have to say after watching Danny and Ellie compete- OMGoddess - for their first International outing that was SPECTACULAR- they are well within the quality needed to skate at US Nationals. I wouldn’t be at all surprised to see them on the podium. I think USFS made the right decision here, much as I call them out.

Danny!!!!!❤️❤️❤️
 
I think we now have the list of who will be competing at Senior Nationals in Pairs. There will be a maximum of 12 teams with 8 byes and the other 4 teams coming from the top four National finishers at the Pairs competition held at Midwestern Sectionals this weekend.

Teams with Byes:
1 Sonia Baram / Daniel Tioumentsev
2 Emily Chan / Spencer Howe
3 Ellie Kam / Danny O'Shea
4 Alexa Knierim / Brandon Frazier
5 Katie McBeath / Nathan Bartholomay
6 Maria Mokhova / Ivan Mokhov
7 Valentina Plazas / Maximiliano Fernandez
8 Anastasiia Smirnova / Danil Siianytsia

Top four National finishers:
11 Grace Hanns / Danny Neudecker
12 Linzy Fitzpatrick / Keyton Bearinger
13 Nina Ouellette / Rique Newby-Estrella
14 Laiken Lockley / Edoardo Caputo

Sonia Baram / Daniel Tioumentsev actually finished first in the Pairs competition this weekend, but they already have a bye so they're not counted. There were only four more teams competing so they all advance to Nationals.
 
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2sk8 said:
I agree - let them all skate - and yet, in some ways, I don't agree because the decisions about who is going to get to skate and have opportunities are not made on a level playing field. Much of it is committee policy, that can be changed at a moment's notice, v. actual rules, and those "policies" are not really applied equally. That is just reality in this sport.

You are correct that one international assignment, from a select list, can grant a bye from NQS. But, it is also true that the Bye Criteria say that "Additionally, all are highly encouraged to participate in the National Qualifying Series via an approved NQS competition." Since ALL of the NQS are long over before Danny & Ellie even announced their partnership, discussions with TPTB must have made it quite clear they would be given whatever assignment was needed to advance on the Nationals. Else, how would they conclude there was no need to skate in any NQS? I know - from the horses' mouths - a similar accomodation was made last year. And, how would they get an international assignment with absolutely no competition score posted, and therefore none at the supposed level that is required to be assigned to an international (although that was de facto reduced this year due to the paucity of pairs)? And, not even added to ISP yet?

If you wanted to compete during the season, it is a very risky move to not compete in the NQS without a clear bye in place. The same thing happened to Danny & Chelsea last year, and it became a moot issue only due to their horrific fall. Thus, logic says they knew they were being given a bye without competing up front, and that is simply not an option for most new teams.

Great for Danny, but maybe not so great for others looking at whether the effort is worth their while. Maybe there would be more pairs if ... well, I guess I think this approach is not so clear cut.

As for the 8 pairs last year, there were a number of withdrawals due to Covid so hopefully that is not a repeat. And, some that moved on were given the message they would not be given competitive opportunities like this without meeting criteria that are adjustable for others. Of course, this reduces the number of teams.

I guess, in a nutshell, I'm happy for Danny but think the management of pairs in the US blatantly S&*#* and does not encourage more pairs to let them all skate. JMHO based on a lot of actual experience :)
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No, it's not an option for most new teams, but most new teams don't contain Danny, who is one of the best pairs guys in the US (my opinion).
I can't decide if I think it's good or bad for some to be told they weren't going to be given competitive opportunities. I guess on balance I think it's good, since they get to make decisions such as Deanna did and move to other countries who will give them those opportunities, rather than stay here and grind away not knowing that no matter how hard they work they aren't going further?
Weathergal said:
I think we now have the list of who will be competing at Senior Nationals in Pairs. There will be a maximum of 12 teams with 8 byes and the other 4 teams coming from the top four National finishers at the Pairs competition held at Midwestern Sectionals this weekend.

Teams with Byes:
1 Sonia Baram / Daniel Tioumentsev
2 Emily Chan / Spencer Howe
3 Ellie Kam / Danny O'Shea
4 Alexa Knierim / Brandon Frazier
5 Katie McBeath / Nathan Bartholomay
6 Maria Mokhova / Ivan Mokhov
7 Valentina Plazas / Maximiliano Fernandez
8 Anastasiia Smirnova / Danil Siianytsia

Top four National finishers:
11 Grace Hanns / Danny Neudecker
12 Linzy Fitzpatrick / Keyton Bearinger
13 Nina Ouellette / Rique Newby-Estrella
14 Laiken Lockley / Edoardo Caputo

Sonia Baram / Daniel Tioumentsev actually finished first in the Pairs competition this weekend, but they already have a bye so they're not counted. There were only four more teams competing so they all advance to Nationals.
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I saw that Cate Finister competed singles. Is she no longer skating pairs? What about her brother?

I need to go watch Ellie and Danny again.
 
For Chan and Howe, the emotional connection they make with audiences means almost as much as the results. The duo are recognized for their artistry and creative programs.

"I feel so much energy from being able to touch people with our skating," Chan said. "That's what brings me fulfillment."

"Everyone's doing relatively the same elements. So having that artistry and skating aspect is what makes it all worth it, and valuable, from a viewer's perspective," Howe declared. "We're in competitive skating, so elements are very important. But we cherish being creative and being able to touch people. It is definitely a big reason why we skate. Without that, we're just robots doing throws and twists."
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Singing: "A-a-a-men" ❤️

Spencer's recurring shoulder injury is worrisome, but at least it sounds like they take time to heal it rather than pushing it.

In Polina Edmonds' recent podcast, Tarah Kayne said it would have been better if she'd taken more time to heal her injuries well. She put pressure on herself to get back to it, because being off the ice herself also meant that her partner was off the ice, or at least not competing the way he and they both wanted to.
 
moonvine said:
I saw that Cate Finister competed singles. Is she no longer skating pairs? What about her brother?
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Kate announced her own retirement (from pairs, I guess) very shortly (I almost said "obscenely shortly") after breaking with Matej Silecky. She texted him that she and her team had decided to "go a different direction," which sounded to me like they had a new partner in mind or in the works. Guess it didn't work out.

moonvine said:
I need to go watch Ellie and Danny again.
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I've watched them multiple times, even when neglecting many other things. Have you watched their gala program? It's their SP to "The Prayer," but they substituted lifts, choreographic lifts and moves for the SBS jump, throw jump and I think SBS spin. It turned out really neat. And beautiful. ❤️
 
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What's the latest with Misha and Hazel? Are they going to make a run to Nationals, or give the partnership more time to gel?

Or did they fizzle out?
 
moonvine said:
I guess on balance I think it's good, since they get to make decisions such as Deanna did and move to other countries who will give them those opportunities, rather than stay here and grind away not knowing that no matter how hard they work they aren't going further?
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Maybe, but then this is inconsistent with the initial discussion that was about encouraging the US to have more pairs. Can't really have it both ways.
 
2sk8 said:
I think you mean Cate Fleming, who was Chase Finster's partner. Cate Fleming competed Senior Ladies.
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Yes, I did mean that, and yes, she competed senior ladies, I was just wondering if she was no longer competing pairs (which appears to be the case)
 
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