2023-24 Russian Women's Figure Skating

[brakes]

Theres no world in which cheating should risk a "living hell" at all, thats the problem. It should risk a ban, a just punishment, thats all - not some massive vengeance and suffering.

Let's stop with dramatic phrasing, what does "living hell" even mean exactly?
I don't know personal life of Johnson, Jones and Armstrong, but I bet they're living ten times better life than average person.
And so will Kamila.

 

[Mathematician]

Let's stop with dramatic phrasing, what does "living hell" even mean exactly?

YOU WERE THE ONE WHO USED THE PHRASE TO BEGIN WITH!! YOU TELL ME!! hahahahahahahaha how lost can you get dude

 

[brakes]

YOU WERE THE ONE WHO USED THE PHRASE TO BEGIN WITH!! YOU TELL ME!! hahahahahahahaha how lost can you get dude

Actually, I didn't. You and Mariot did.
Instead of burning out your capslock led, better read closely your own posts.

 

[Mathematician]

Actually, I didn't. You and Mariot did.
Instead of burning out your capslock led, better read closely your own posts.

Buddy I just went back and the term living hell was first used by yourself. Regardless your acceptance of the term and subsequent justifying that it is a reasonable outcome for "cheating" gives you the burden of definition still. So, go ahead and explain what living hell means and why it would be ok for a girl to get her life (all of skating and her academy she did everything in for her whole life) taken from her for cheating after already getting banned for competition and all other athletes got their medals. Explain what justice lies in that. You crave vengeance and want to revel in this small victory of her downfall but it wont fill the void and unrest in your soul, sorry. Find God.

 

[brakes]

Buddy I just went back and the term living hell was first used by yourself.

Link/post number/page?

 

[Mathematician]

Link/post number/page?

Dont care, stop crutching on irrelevant technicalities and respond to what matters

"Regardless your acceptance of the term and subsequent justifying that it is a reasonable outcome for "cheating" gives you the burden of definition still. So, go ahead and explain what living hell means and why it would be ok for a girl to get her life (all of skating and her academy she did everything in for her whole life) taken from her for cheating after already getting banned for competition and all other athletes got their medals. Explain what justice lies in that. You crave vengeance and want to revel in this small victory of her downfall but it wont fill the void and unrest in your soul, sorry. Find God."

You lose.

 

[brakes]

Dont care, stop crutching on irrelevant technicalities and respond to what matters

 

[Mathematician]

It must be a big hit to your esteem, that you put your entire identity into such thing and still get expertly deconstructed and turbo nuked at every corner. you just have to cut out my post and hide, hahaha. everyone can see it ))))

 

[brakes]

It must be a big hit to your esteem, that you put your entire identity into such thing and still get expertly deconstructed and turbo nuked at every corner. you just have to cut out my post and hide, hahaha. everyone can see it ))))

Try to deconstruct state of a person writing over-dramatic phrases in their posts and then accusing others of using them.

 

[Mathematician]

Try to deconstruct state of a person writing over-dramatic phrases in their posts and then accusing others of using them.

You did use them, even if I constructed it you still used it. what accusation? LOL.

ok how about this, lets redefine then, so you cannot run. i have the time. living hell, doesnt exist. lets say this: Valieva is punished by being barred from the location she grew up in, was educated in, spent her entire career and life endeavors in, made all of her friends and connections and basically knows nothing else. she was banned for this because of something she did in a competition, therefore actions should be taken in regards to competition not personal life. would you like to explain how them putting severe, probation-tier limitation on her personal life, and not just at a small level, but on a massive level which provable encapsulates her entire life experience, is justifiable?

 

[brakes]

You did use them, even if I constructed it you still used it. what accusation? LOL.

ok how about this, lets redefine then, so you cannot run. i have the time. living hell, doesnt exist. lets say this: Valieva is punished by being barred from the location she grew up in, was educated in, spent her entire career and life endeavors in, made all of her friends and connections and basically knows nothing else. she was banned for this because of something she did in a competition, therefore actions should be taken in regards to competition not personal life. would you like to explain how them putting severe, probation-tier limitation on her personal life, and not just at a small level, but on a massive level which provable encapsulates her entire life experience, is justifiable?

You mean training rink?

First thing out of my mind: I wouldn't like cheating athlete presence anywhere near young kids pursuing excelence in her sport to avoid potential direct negative influence or just exposing children to a bad example.

 

[Mathematician]

You mean training rink?

First thing out of my mind: I wouldn't like cheating athlete presence anywhere near young kids pursuing excelence in her sport to avoid potential direct negative influence or just exposing children to a bad example.

Too bad thats a subjective moral argument with countless nuances and supportable counter measures which could never warrant objective legislation. She already smeared as a cheater anyways, girls who know that will either follow her regardless or be deluded that she actually got set up which would happen anyways by mass propaganda.

 

[brakes]

Too bad thats a subjective moral argument with countless nuances and supportable counter measures which could never warrant objective legislation. She already smeared as a cheater anyways, girls who know that will either follow her regardless or be deluded that she actually got set up which would happen anyways by mass propaganda.

Possibility of corrupting young athletes by a person or bad example is objective practical argument.

 

[Mathematician]

Possibility of corrupting young athletes by a person or bad example is objective practical argument.

And so who corrupted her? Did she start the doping band wagon herself? Where is the clause about this? And how long should she be banned for from seeing people? Once her competitive ban is over is she magically the good guy again who cant corrupt anybody? Give me a break, its doping not murder. Taking her entire lifes work has no basis in anything.

 

[TallyT]

99.99999% of sports cheaters or general 17-year-old lawbreakers would love a 'living hell' which includes all the money, fame and adulation - and their whole country indulging their martyr imagine - that Valieva has. I'll withhold my sympathy for the skaters. Russian and other, that the all-now-tainted Team Tut waltzed over the last few years.

 

[Mathematician]

99.99999% of sports cheaters or general 17-year-old lawbreakers would love a 'living hell' which includes all the money, fame and adulation - and their whole country indulging their martyr imagine - that Valieva has. I'll withhold my sympathy for the skaters. Russian and other, that the all-now-tainted Team Tut waltzed over the last few years.

Lol famous and rich people have significantly higher rates of mental illness than normal people as it is, never mind when half the world is against you and you're a scapegoat for psychopaths who got zero punishment. Your assumption is statistically proven invalid, its been a known fact money and specifically fame is something thats destroys you.

 

[Skating91]

You mean training rink?

First thing out of my mind: I wouldn't like cheating athlete presence anywhere near young kids pursuing excelence in her sport to avoid potential direct negative influence or just exposing children to a bad example.

We have no idea if she willfully cheated, but that hasn't stopped anyone making accusations and assumptions for two years. She is guilty until proven innocent. Given that it is a trace amount of a common drug that seems to offer little benefit to an athlete, given such a short shelf life of the drug and knowing with certainty she would be tested when she finished on the podium at the Russian championships, a lot of it does not make any sense.

Athletes who had their urine swapped at Sochi certainly cheated we have proof of this, we have proof of a doping ring, but no proof that Kamila cheated just that she had a trace amount of this drug in her system, which could have got there any number of ways most likely contamination but Kamila's lawyers weren't able to prove this to a level that satisfied CAS.

I don't know if she's been badly represented. At that hastily convened hearing they did propose that she may have caught it from the grandfather's utensils. It seems obvious that this was just a theory put together with the 48 hours notice they had, obviously it would be impossible to prove Kamila was in Beijing, was no time to investigate, but offered this theory to CAS as a way of saying we don't know how it happened but she is close to someone who takes TMZ so it is how it could have happened, but until we investigate further we don't know. Somehow this got blown completely out of proportion into being the definitive theory, and the lawyers have continued down this path of contamination from the grandfather two years after first proposing. Maybe no-one genuinely knows how it got in her system, and this was the best theory they could offer.

In retrospect, the lawyers at the first hearing should not have said anything. Instead of offering a theory with no evidence. Say we have no idea how it got into her system until we investigate since the theory had no bearing on the initial decision made by CAS.

Also, the huge delay in relaying the result to her (WADA's were supposed to have returned this by mid-January but waited until the completion of the team event) meant she wasn't able to commence the investigation into how the drug got into her system until late February when it should have been taking place mid-January at the latest. What evidence was lost in this time, were CCTV recordings lost, were supplement bottles finished and thrown away? I really can't believe that this wouldn't be taken into account of the severity of the suspension. Given it is four year for a protected person no less, it seems it had no effect at all and WADA's lab's have zero responsibility or accountability. The only person held accountable is the child who was 15 at the time.

 

[Mathematician]

We have no idea if she willfully cheated, but that hasn't stopped anyone making accusations and assumptions for two years. She is guilty until proven innocent. Given that it is a trace amount of a common drug that seems to offer little benefit to an athlete, given such a short shelf life of the drug and knowing with certainty she would be tested when she finished on the podium at the Russian championships, a lot of it does not make any sense.

Athletes who had their urine swapped at Sochi certainly cheated we have proof of this, we have proof of a doping ring, but no proof that Kamila cheated just that she had a trace amount of this drug in her system, which could have got there any number of ways most likely contamination but Kamila's lawyers weren't able to prove this to a level that satisfied CAS.

I don't know if she's been badly represented. At that hastily convened hearing they did propose that she may have caught it from the grandfather's utensils. It seems obvious that this was just a theory put together with the 48 hours notice they had, obviously it would be impossible to prove Kamila was in Beijing, was no time to investigate, but offered this theory to CAS as a way of saying we don't know how it happened but she is close to someone who takes TMZ so it is how it could have happened, but until we investigate further we don't know. Somehow this got blown completely out of proportion into being the definitive theory, and the lawyers have continued down this path of contamination from the grandfather two years after first proposing. Maybe no-one genuinely knows how it got in her system, and this was the best theory they could offer.

In retrospect, the lawyers at the first hearing should not have said anything. Instead of offering a theory with no evidence. Say we have no idea how it got into her system until we investigate since the theory had no bearing on the initial decision made by CAS.

Also, the huge delay in relaying the result to her (WADA's were supposed to have returned this by mid-January but waited until the completion of the team event) meant she wasn't able to commence the investigation into how the drug got into her system until late February when it should have been taking place mid-January at the latest. What evidence was lost in this time, were CCTV recordings lost, were supplement bottles finished and thrown away? I really can't believe that this wouldn't be taken into account of the severity of the suspension. Given it is four year for a protected person no less, it seems it had no effect at all and WADA's lab's have zero responsibility or accountability. The only person held accountable is the child who was 15 at the time.

Its pointless. Justice only exists in the next life. You're either strong enough to make it there or not. She is damned forever by these people who dont even think twice about anything that matters. Sit and post and scroll... try to fill that empty hole. You cant reason with them. Everything here is all garbage.

 

[Mathematician]

We have no idea if she willfully cheated, but that hasn't stopped anyone making accusations and assumptions for two years. She is guilty until proven innocent. Given that it is a trace amount of a common drug that seems to offer little benefit to an athlete, given such a short shelf life of the drug and knowing with certainty she would be tested when she finished on the podium at the Russian championships, a lot of it does not make any sense.

Athletes who had their urine swapped at Sochi certainly cheated we have proof of this, we have proof of a doping ring, but no proof that Kamila cheated just that she had a trace amount of this drug in her system, which could have got there any number of ways most likely contamination but Kamila's lawyers weren't able to prove this to a level that satisfied CAS.

I don't know if she's been badly represented. At that hastily convened hearing they did propose that she may have caught it from the grandfather's utensils. It seems obvious that this was just a theory put together with the 48 hours notice they had, obviously it would be impossible to prove Kamila was in Beijing, was no time to investigate, but offered this theory to CAS as a way of saying we don't know how it happened but she is close to someone who takes TMZ so it is how it could have happened, but until we investigate further we don't know. Somehow this got blown completely out of proportion into being the definitive theory, and the lawyers have continued down this path of contamination from the grandfather two years after first proposing. Maybe no-one genuinely knows how it got in her system, and this was the best theory they could offer.

In retrospect, the lawyers at the first hearing should not have said anything. Instead of offering a theory with no evidence. Say we have no idea how it got into her system until we investigate since the theory had no bearing on the initial decision made by CAS.

Also, the huge delay in relaying the result to her (WADA's were supposed to have returned this by mid-January but waited until the completion of the team event) meant she wasn't able to commence the investigation into how the drug got into her system until late February when it should have been taking place mid-January at the latest. What evidence was lost in this time, were CCTV recordings lost, were supplement bottles finished and thrown away? I really can't believe that this wouldn't be taken into account of the severity of the suspension. Given it is four year for a protected person no less, it seems it had no effect at all and WADA's lab's have zero responsibility or accountability. The only person held accountable is the child who was 15 at the time.

Trust me, I even tried playing on their field, give them the presupposition that the ban is irrelevant, just stop damning the girl, save her person if not her career, but they wont budge, they arent even in control of their actions, at all. Logic is not a factor here.

 

[Skating91]

Lol famous and rich people have significantly higher rates of mental illness than normal people as it is, never mind when half the world is against you and you're a scapegoat for psychopaths who got zero punishment. Your assumption is statistically proven invalid, its been a known fact money and specifically fame is something thats destroys you.

It's so vicious what she is subjected to. Football fans can be crazed and take things too far against people, but it's in the context of that person wearing the wrong colour shirt and if they swapped teams they would cheered and anything forgiven.

This is vicious, violent, relentless abuse and cyberbullying. It's really personal too, they utterly despise her it's like she represents evil, still there is zero proof that she willfully took this drug (we'll see what is in the judgement when it released I suppose but it will shed little).

I'm very sorry for the lack of humanity and basic compassion. We are not all like this in the western world, believe me.