2022 U.S. Championships: Senior Women's Short Program | Page 45 | Golden Skate

2022 U.S. Championships: Senior Women's Short Program

Tomadeur

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 14, 2018
Country
Germany
That's not true, at all. Ashley Wagner won 12 Grand Prix medals, and 5 of those were gold medals. She won 1 silver and 2 bronze medals at Grand Prix Finals from 2012 to 2015. She won 4 Continents in 2012, and she won the silver medal at the 2016 World Championships.

Bradie Tennell has won 4 GP medals, since 2017, and a bronze at 4CC. Gracie Gold won 6 GP medals. While Karen Chen hasn't won GP medals, she's won medals at Challengers, as has Bradie. Mariah Bell has won 4 Grand Prix medals, as well as a number of medals at Challengers. There may be more examples, but it's too late for me to look up any more.
First of all, I would like to say that my statement shouldn't diminish the achievements of Wagner, Tennell, Bell and co. because they are all great figure skaters.

I just wanted to say that I understand that the US fed and the american press are pushing Lyu and hoping that she can consistently compete for medals at the big competitions. For decades, the U.S. ladies were always on the podium at the Olympics, were almost always on the podium at World Championships and the Grand Prix Finals. In short, the US women's team was the gold standard in figure skating and by far the most successful team.

Since 2006, medals at the major events have been the absolute exception and there haven't really been any contenders for victory at these events. But when you've been so successful, you wish you could continue those successes again. And when a promising talent is found among the juniors, the hype is all too understandable. Part of the hope is certainly due to the development of the russian juniors. Not even two years ago, there was a discussion about whether Lyu could beat Valieva at the Junior Worlds with her more difficult jumps.
 

BabySloth

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 27, 2019
Country
Hungary
Levito was the only one that was magical for me. What a complete program and beautifully performed. Why are so few American women not trying, seemingly, to advance technically? Why aren't their coaches encouraging them to (if that's the case)? I always remember the jist of what Frank said to Michelle: advance or get left behind in the dust.
To be fair Isabeau is 14 years old. It's much easier to advance technically at that age. It's also natural for her since the Russian/Japanese/Korean skaters of her age are doing the same, so there's peer pressure. Alysa and Mia Kalin are trying ambitious content as well.

I actually see some of the older skaters trying like Amber with her triple Axel or Bradie (poor her). But I imagine it's much more difficult to learn new big jumps after puberty. When they were Isabeau's age, no one thought that the technical "revolution" in women's singles would get so big in just a few short years.
 

[email protected]

Medalist
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
I think Isabeau and Lindsay should have both scored higher. But Isabeau is young and can't make the Olympic Team, and I knew that Lindsay wouldn't be placed in the Top 3. I have seen great improvement by both, and very well done skates as well.

It's quite a valid point. For me Isabeau's UR on a 3Lo was more or less similar to those that Karen and Mariah had on their 3Ts. But she was "punished" and they were not. As for the second mark she was clearly "wuzzrobbed". In fact I would score Karen, Mariah, and Isabeau within 1 point.

But from the big picture view it makes sense so that ineligible junior skater does not "cloud the view of the podium" for which would be Olympic team members compete. Somehow this logic passed by many contributors here and even more on the Russian boards when they like vultures attacked Anna who "should have been placed below juniors".
 

lariko

Medalist
Joined
Jan 31, 2019
Country
Canada
But from the big picture view it makes sense so that ineligible junior skater does not "cloud the view of the podium" for which would be Olympic team members compete. Somehow this logic passed by many contributors here and even more on the Russian boards when they like vultures attacked Anna who "should have been placed below juniors".
Because injustice is the hardest thing to live down.
 
Joined
Mar 21, 2018
Country
Norway
So finally awake enough to actually share my thoughts in this thread. I was really tired while watching it live last night and wasn´t able to keep up with the thread, but it was worth staying awake for!

I have to go back and rewatch some of the skates. Thanks to Olympic Channel streaming it and make it possible to watch with both such high quality.

So first of all, I wanted to say something about Jill Heiner because she impressed me. Boy does she have great jumps and such a joy of a personality! Kate Wang was another highlight for me, so clean and nice skate.

I don´t know what to say about Amber but that was really heartbreaking. Even with the mistakes I did not think the judges would give her that low score, that was really harsh. All though, she has nothing to loose so I hope she at least will have the FS of her life. I have a feeling she will land the 3A now that the pressure is kinda off. But anyways, it won´t make up for the mistakes from the SP so unless something odd happens she will not be going to Beijing :(

Gracie Gold clean skate was the best thing off the SP for me, it really was a one of those magic moment which I have been waiting and dreaming off. Her smile, the audience giving standing O. Well in my mind I had perhaps pictured a full audience, but I take what we get in this pandemic days. I wish though the judges would have given her 1-2 points more and more close to the 70, her performance was better then in Alpharetta but the scores didn´t reflect that. But judges was stingy with others so i´m not surprised either. Most important thing is Gracie will skate in the last group in the FS and it was just enough to push her into that final group!!! This might boost her score more in the FS if she can pull off a similar performance.

Levito was lovely as always. It´s nice to see the 3Lz-3Lo combo. She pulls it off and she looks so confident and i´m sure she will skate a clean FS and set the standard for the final group. She has no fear in skating, it´s like she flies over the ice and that is so nice to watch. I can see how she is inspired by Zhenya.

Mariah put on such a lovely performance. She really delivers and she looked fast and sharp. IMO she was a bit overscored on some of the elements. She got over 8 points for her lutz, which I think was quite generous. All though I have to say I agree with the standings so i´m not going to argue about scores and I was kinda expecting it.

I think Karens performance was the second best for me after Gracie. The new SP was just lovely to watch, such an outstanding performance, and that dress was absolute stunning and fitted the program so well. This is one of those programs that screams of Olympic. Something to remember. I think it´s rightly that she placed just second after Mariah because of her combo and she deserved the highest PCS mark. I´m glad both Mariah and Karen landed the triple triple.

Lindsay came out there and skated the life out of her. She is so strong and confident. Her combo looked better now and her spins and all is rock solid. She actually reminds me a lot of Bradie with her technical strengths, it´s superb. All though, I have to say I disagree with you that Lindsay was robbed and should place higher. I actually think her score was pretty decent for her skate. She does not have the same natural ability of performance like Mariah and Karen, I find her movements to be rather stiff and a bit slow. But she is still young and can improve her PCS marks, it will be better eventually. If Lindsay should have placed higher she must had pulled out a clean 3A.

I´m not sure what I feel about Alysas performance. First of all she looked completely different with the bangs and all and I also felt she was even taller then a few weeks ago. It´s quite obvious she is going trough a rather big change in her life, not just by the looks but mentally also. It´s something about her presence on ice that is different. When that said, with all that it´s kinda impressive that she still can pull out such a strong skate, she must be very hardworking. But there is something that is maybe a bit off. It´s difficult to tell if the coaching change is good for her or not. But i´m not sure why she went for the 3A in the SP, I don´t think it was a wise move, but I guess her spot on the Olympic Team is safe.....

I´m actually not sure anymore what the podium will be, I think the National Champion could be anyone now. The FS is going to be so exciting. Anyways, the ladies pulled off a lot of strong clean skates, i´m really impressed! :clap: :clap:
 
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R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
I didn't feel it from her [Liu] like that at all. In fact, I didn't see any stress there. What I saw was negligence, disinterest, sloppiness, tiredness. She just went through the motions of her program like pretending to work - like she is doing just enough to avoid being lectured. It seems to me she just didn't care what her scores will be at all. Considering what she said in her last public IG stream (she said she is hating figure skating or something like that) - I am not surprised. I see a kid who just don't want to do what she's been told to.
Wow. Is this true? Can this be confirmed?

But to be fair…even if I otherwise liked something, I think I would grow to resent or hate it too if everyone in the media, federation, and fan base was anointing me as The Next Great One and expecting medals and the ability to fill the shoes of past greats…this is why I cringe every time I see someone being hyped up. And this is to speak nothing of family pressures…which can make the situation even worse…

Also remember that she is in her teenage years, so there’s that dynamic playing out too. After the Olympic season is up, Team Liu can evaluate the situation and whether she wants to continue or not.

Now, having said all that, all this must be ultimately accepted as part of the game and something to overcome if success is what she truly desires.
 
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Ziotic

Medalist
Joined
Dec 23, 2016
I think Liu is quite upset about the coaching change and he lost a little spark as a result. It’s too bad she’s still a minor and can’t really control what the adults are doing. It must be super crushing for your confidence when your own parent feels you aren’t meeting their goals and this forces a new training regime on you
 

katymay

Medalist
Joined
Mar 7, 2006
Lindsay really is the best pure jumper here.
Actually, I think Gracie Gold is the best pure jumper, and she was last year as well...in practice. Happy to see a different Gracie this year-even in practice-instead of meandering around pointlessly, (last year) she has been running long segments and not leaving out the elements. If only her prep had been at this level last year, she could have contended for an Olympic spot-especially given the weak US field.
 

LiamForeman

William/Uilyam
Medalist
Joined
Nov 24, 2006
I don´t know what to say about Amber but that was really heartbreaking. Even with the mistakes I did not think the judges would give her that low score, that was really harsh. All though, she has nothing to loose so I hope she at least will have the FS of her life. I have a feeling she will land the 3A now that the pressure is kinda off. But anyways, it won´t make up for the mistakes from the SP so unless something odd happens she will not be going to Beijing :(
I appreciate your overall post. As for Amber.... Well, at least I'm thinking USFS breathed a collective sigh of relief when her SP scores came up. Amber was never a fed favorite, certainly compared to Karen Chen, so USFS doesn't have to sweat/worry naming an Olympic/Worlds team with Karen again even when she places lower than someone else. But dang, Amber? The combo was bad luck, just a bad enough landing to not get that 3toe in successfully. The 2loop? Headcaseitis. Such a shame. I guess her plan will/should be to just go all out in the LP. Put in the 3axel(s) since she has nothing to lose and what difference does it make if she places 7th instead of 11th? Skate well for yourself tonight, Amber. I'm rooting for you to come off the ice tonight with pride. Good luck to her.
 

katymay

Medalist
Joined
Mar 7, 2006
I think Liu is quite upset about the coaching change and he lost a little spark as a result. It’s too bad she’s still a minor and can’t really control what the adults are doing. It must be super crushing for your confidence when your own parent feels you aren’t meeting their goals and this forces a new training regime on you
The Lord giveth triple axels, and the Lord taketh them away. I think her instagram venting was more about being frustrated over that one jump, something every skater can appreciate.
 

LiamForeman

William/Uilyam
Medalist
Joined
Nov 24, 2006
I think Liu is quite upset about the coaching change and he lost a little spark as a result. It’s too bad she’s still a minor and can’t really control what the adults are doing. It must be super crushing for your confidence when your own parent feels you aren’t meeting their goals and this forces a new training regime on you
Yes, something was just so off about her, even since NHK. Her infectious smile wasn't really there either. Not like I need to see fakey smiles, but with Alysa it was evident to me that she's lost something in the last four weeks. Hopefully the emotional toll of this season isn't sapping from Alysa what makes her so special as a skater. I didn't recognize her physically when she came up on my screen, but I also didn't really recognize her SKATING which just didn't seem as sharp and committed as I've come to expect from her. I hope she can just put it together tonight and be happy with her performance. Good luck.
 
Joined
Mar 21, 2018
Country
Norway
I appreciate your overall post. As for Amber.... Well, at least I'm thinking USFS breathed a collective sigh of relief when her SP scores came up. Amber was never a fed favorite, certainly compared to Karen Chen, so USFS doesn't have to sweat/worry naming an Olympic/Worlds team with Karen again even when she places lower than someone else. But dang, Amber? The combo was bad luck, just a bad enough landing to not get that 3toe in successfully. The 2loop? Headcaseitis. Such a shame. I guess her plan will/should be to just go all out in the LP. Put in the 3axel(s) since she has nothing to lose and what difference does it make if she places 7th instead of 11th? Skate well for yourself tonight, Amber. I'm rooting for you to come off the ice tonight with pride. Good luck to her.
Yes...and look at it that way, what if Amber had skated well and placed above for example Mariah or Karen, would they still send her? We would never know but I guess USFS would not have to worry about that anymore. Actually the spots for 4CC is still something she should think about though, so 7th instead of 11th could matter. I guess if Karen, Mariah and Alysa goes to Beijing, Lindsay would go to 4CC, and then perhaps Gabriella Izzo and there is still one remaining spot. Gracie doesn´t have the minimum and Isabeau is too young. Does Kate Wang and Jill Heiner have the minimum and are they old enough? Because if Amber wants the 4CC she might want to place above Wang and Heiner in the FS. Or not get beaten by Starr.
 

moonvine

All Hail Queen Gracie
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 14, 2007
Country
United-States
Coach change affects her emotionally. I truly believe that's her dad decision, not hers. Obviously, she lost the joy and passion for skating. She is still a good skater and competitor though. As long as she can fully rotate triple triple in later half, she will be fine. Also, she should do 2A instead of 3A in the short. Her 3A is far from ready. The question is.....who should do the team event now?

I just think this is so interesting (and though I hadn’t learned how to insert media I can’t get it to work right now) where Alysa says “skating is her hobby.” I would not think an elite skater would think of skating as their hobby. She also says in another tweet that her goal isn’t to beat the Russians. What do y’all make of this?

 

[email protected]

Medalist
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 26, 2014
Because injustice is the hardest thing to live down.
There is no universal justice in this world. There are people's emotions regarding what they believe is injustice. There are counter emotions of other people. As a result there are conflicts. Was Isabeau underscored? I think, absolutely. But may be it is my bias. Because, to me it's not about her having Yulia Kuznetsova as a coach. It's about her balerina style skating (I would not go further saying "Russian style skating"). And this style is my favorite one.
 
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