ISU takes one further step towards raising the age limit

[moonvine]

Washington Post has an article.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/olympics/2022/05/02/figure-skating-age-requirement-isu/

 

[anonymoose_au]

What's the reason for it to be 17 years old rather than 16?

16 seems OK to prevent the whole "Protected person" palava, but 17 seems a bit much. It'll mean that anyone born after 30th June in a year won't be able to go senior until 18.

Will they end up raising the Junior age too?

Hmmmm

 

[Dreamer57]

What's the reason for it to be 17 years old rather than 16?

16 seems OK to prevent the whole "Protected person" palava, but 17 seems a bit much. It'll mean that anyone born after 30th June in a year won't be able to go senior until 18.

Will they end up raising the Junior age too?

Hmmmm

I'm sure I read from the survey on social media that the junior age could be increasing to 14. Although I don't know when this could be implemented.

 

[Joe Mendoza]

idk if raising the age limit is the be-all end-all solution. we certainly saw how the Chinese gymnastics delegation in 2008 took advantage of the age fakery.

 

[Ziotic]

What's the reason for it to be 17 years old rather than 16?

16 seems OK to prevent the whole "Protected person" palava, but 17 seems a bit much. It'll mean that anyone born after 30th June in a year won't be able to go senior until 18.

Will they end up raising the Junior age too?

Hmmmm

I think that’s the point, that the skaters be 17/18 not 15/16.

In many countries 18 is adult.

 

[Amei]

idk if raising the age limit is the be-all end-all solution. we certainly saw how the Chinese gymnastics delegation in 2008 took advantage of the age fakery.

Ehh, I think faking a skater's age is going to be more difficult nowadays with how active a lot of these skating clubs and skaters are on social media. I mean a child's parent (though we know some do) would have to decide the moment their child is born that they are going to be a figure skating champion and perpetually fudge the child's age.

 

[Amei]

What's the reason for it to be 17 years old rather than 16?

16 seems OK to prevent the whole "Protected person" palava, but 17 seems a bit much. It'll mean that anyone born after 30th June in a year won't be able to go senior until 18.

Will they end up raising the Junior age too?

Hmmmm

I'm content with them raising the age to 16 to remove the 'protected person' status from the senior ranks. 17 seems unnecessary, so many people pretend like this will mean quads/triple axels won't happen - that cat is out of the bag unless someone gets grievously injured its unlikely they go away, even if they disallow them (for both men/women) in juniors the athletes will still train them outside of competition because they know they'll need them to win on the senior circuit.

 

[4everchan]

I'm content with them raising the age to 16 to remove the 'protected person' status from the senior ranks. 17 seems unnecessary, so many people pretend like this will mean quads/triple axels won't happen - that cat is out of the bag unless someone gets grievously injured its unlikely they go away, even if they disallow them (for both men/women) in juniors the athletes will still train them outside of competition because they know they'll need them to win on the senior circuit.

I don't believe it's the end of quads or triple axels. I am in favour of raising the age for seniors for other reasons, including longevity. There are ways to train, learn the big tricks and still be skating at let's say 22. Instead of trying to get it all done at 15, delaying puberty as much as possible, and sacrificing other aspects of skating, just to max out the point system. I love big jumps but I especially love complete skaters who manage to participate in 2-3 olympics... oh wait... i guess my username says it all.

 

[Alex65]

Hello everyone! I saw in this thread a discussion of the ban of fours for juniors. I'm wondering: is the ban 3A also implied? Or is 3A something else?

 

[Amei]

Hello everyone! I saw in this thread a discussion of the ban of fours for juniors. I'm wondering: is the ban 3A also implied? Or is 3A something else?

Girls cannot do a solo triple axel for their axel jump, the loophole they do have is that they can do it as part of their triple-triple combination

 

[Zora]

What's the reason for it to be 17 years old rather than 16?

16 seems OK to prevent the whole "Protected person" palava, but 17 seems a bit much. It'll mean that anyone born after 30th June in a year won't be able to go senior until 18.

Will they end up raising the Junior age too?

Hmmmm

I can think of many Japanese skaters, who showed promising results at the age of 16 and who disappeared only a year later, so I think 17 actually makes sense. For example Marin Honda, Yuka Nagai, Yuna Shiraiwa.
Also many American skaters, Caroline Zhang, Mirai Nagasu (yes, she fought her way back in her 20s), Rachael Flatt. I think it's only Russian skaters, who aren't affected by puberty until 18. No, actually they are, for example Radionova.

 

[macy]

if this passes the way skaters train over the next several years will change, especially those who are very young right now and have another 5-10 years before they hit 17. we won't see quads and 3As by pre teens and early teens the way we do now...whats the point of burning yourself out before you even hit senior? i think we will see those jumps from older teens instead and coaches will learn they will need to pace their skaters and completely change things to make sure they last until that age.

editing to add i think this will also encourage coaches to teach sustainable technique instead of just getting the jump landed well enough to put in a program.

 

[kolyadafan2002]

I think it's perfectly relevant to point out Wakaba has a 3A, as does Tuktamysheva. With the talent in Russia, it's perfectly reasonable to assume they are able to produce adults who can do Ultra-C elements IF incentivised to change their training methodology - and this is certainly a huge incentive.

 

[Amei]

I think it's perfectly relevant to point out Wakaba has a 3A, as does Tuktamysheva. With the talent in Russia, it's perfectly reasonable to assume they are able to produce adults who can do Ultra-C elements IF incentivised to change their training methodology - and this is certainly a huge incentive.

Shcherbakova and Trusova are both 18 or close to it and still have their quads so the current training method has produced skaters that have kept their jumps past puberty. Or is the adult mark moving again because these 2 haven't lost their quads yet?

 

[Ziotic]

Shcherbakova and Trusova are both 18 or close to it and still have their quads so the current training method has produced skaters that have kept their jumps past puberty. Or is the adult mark moving again because these 2 haven't lost their quads yet?

Trusova has certainly kept and improved.

Anna’s jumps, including triples have regressed in quality so although she can do them they sure don’t look nice or easy.

 

[lariko]

Shcherbakova and Trusova are both 18 or close to it and still have their quads so the current training method has produced skaters that have kept their jumps past puberty. Or is the adult mark moving again because these 2 haven't lost their quads yet?

If anything, Trusova is gaining quads as she ages... and Russian women routinely trained quads 20 years ago which is something I picked up from Smirnova's interview, so I doubt they would stop doing them in training because age is raised by a couple of years, given how the competition is on junior level.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Russians aren't going to stop training ultra-C elements, nor should they. An age limit won't stop it. They know those jumps constitute the most impressive and truly the hardest elements in skating. The ISU could make a 3A/quads the same value as a 2A/triple in women's and Russians will still go for the 3A/quads... and do them. It's like pairs who do quad throws even though a solid triple is worth about the same - they don't care about the points, they care about pushing the sport.

 

[el henry]

If raising the age limit means they learn a sustainable technique, one that can used at a healthy skating weight, post puberty, well, raising the age limit,

One way to push the sport is jumps. Another way is amazing choreo. Another way is beautiful, flexible spins. Another way is skating skills with deep edges and complete control. I celebrate all those ways to push the sport.

And if any country chooses to train in a way that their skaters have one good senior year, or no good senior years, or don't learn to push the sport in all these various ways, well, so be it, that's too bad, but not a reason to keep the age limit as is now.

Another question: isn't this proposal favored to pass?

 

[Supernovaimplosion]

When are they meeting?

 

[Lipinski boy]

Is there a thread about the possible effects this will have on the technical difficulty of women’s FS programs? Of course, I am all about safety of the athletes, but I do fear raising the age minimum will severely limit the number of athletes training for quads. With women’s changing bodies (leaner smaller bodies favor more difficult jumps) will older athletes force women to revert back to the triple-triple as the ’most challenging’ element as it was in the past?
I am a little disheartened to see men starting to pull off quad axels while women seem to be returning back to where they were. I am tired of hearing unsavory conversations about how “men are just stronger.”