Men Free Skate - What were the judges thinking???

[BittyBug]

Didn't Li have that crazy exhibition a couple of years ago with the multi-colored furry arms to some type of Latin music? It was quite a change of pace from his typical competitive programs, and showed that he can be can be both extroverted and extremely engaged with the audience.

I really like Li's skating, and I hope that he will be able to maximize his programs under CoP for next year. IMO, the judges have simply not been applying the PCS portion of CoP properly, and Li is not the only one who has been impacted, unfortunately. I hope the ISU will implement clearer guidelines for next year and provide the proper training to improve this situation.

 

[emma]

But Li properbaly more into traditional chinese marshal arts, just like Elvi Stojk's Japanese marshal arts. All Li's great performance are those he interpreting the traditional chinese marshall arts, If only you understand the traditional chinese marshall arts (WuShu) you'd appreciate Li's program, IMO, he truely transident the WuShu imagine on to the ice.

I, once again, am behind in the reading of posts....but when I read this I was like RIHGT...that's why I like Li so much...I love martial arts (well, martial arts films specifically, i'm not knowledgable about the vast body of marital arts). I still have to review the program and his marks compared to others, but i just had this gut feeling he was marked a bit low. Now i have to find videos to go over this. Also, I didn't see his exhibition but now i'm even more curious and eager to see it.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Li's improved 100 per cent over the years. His biggest problem right now, imo, is his energy. If the CoP is really fair to all skaters, Li should be on the podium next year.

Catch his exhibition number (too bad they didn't show the LP). It's cute and he does show a sense of humor.

Joe

 

[Vash01]

My impressions:
Li was robbed big time (and the only bad spin he had was that Klimkin rip off spin where he travelled all over.. all of his other spins were good)
I liked Stephane Lambiel better last year. This King Arthur program looks hastily choreographed and he could do a whole lot better than this.
Buttle wasn't all that (and I normally like him).
Evan really reminds me of Ilia Kulik both in body type and the jumps. It's no wonder that they both shared the same coach (Evan was coached by Kundravstiev(sp?) before going to Carroll).

Lindemann will make a comeback for the Olympics. He is not a fluke.

Klimkin would have done really well here even with his normal mistakes.

Plush really is two notches above everyone else. The quality of the men's skating really goes down when he's not there. Plush's crappy (for him) SP was skated with more conviction and fire than any of these guys can muster.

ITA. Even if Li does not have the high level spins or footwork, he should get credit for jumps that he does well. When a skater with 2 falls comes out ahead, the pendulum has swung too far in the other direction. I absolutely loved Buttle's SP but I can't say that about the LP (with mistakes). Johnny Weir actually skated very well, except for the fall on the 3A in the SP. He should have been on the podium.

Plushenko skated a good SP, except for that fall on the quad. It looked like he could not do the quad because of the groin injury, so it made sense for him to withdraw. Even with the fall, his SP was skated with conviction, and other jumps were OK (axel and lutz). His withdrawal gave others the taste of the kind of pressure he has been handling over the years. Most of them fell apart. Lambiel won the competition on the basis of his QR and SP- that is when Plushenko was in the competition. His LP included two singled triples, and finishing 10 seconds behind the music. Those are not minor mistakes. Joubert fell apart like no one else.He was considered the closest rival to Plushenko, and he must have felt the pressure the most when Plushenko pulled out. I hope he can heal and show everyone again what a great skater he is. His presence alone will make many others skate 100% better.

Vash

 

[ceg15]

Ok - The mens long was very well judged in my opinion. They didnt go by who has the most potential, who's usually on the top, who's won the most comptitions. The judges judged it by who had the performance of the night and I think they did a great job. Brian bombed, Weir wasnt on the ball, Evgeni pulled out. Then the others stepped in. Jeffrey Buttle is a truly talented, amazing skater who is just now being awarded with the COP system. He definitely deserved to be on the podium. 2nd is great for him-he deserved! Evan deserved 3rd-he had great skates, good for him! Stephane got 1st cause he should've.

 

[hockeyfan228]

Weir had three weak skates in the competition -- that is weak for him as a very top-level international skater. His injured foot held him back in all three phases, particulary in the qualis and LP, where he was relatively slow and tentative. In the LP, not only did trip on a footwork sequence that had been going beautifully until then, and which was one of only two L2 elements he performed, but he also had two flawed jumps, albeit not falls. He was, in my opinion, overrated on most of his spins, which received positive GOE. (And it's not just my opinion, it's also Weir's and Paul Wylie's.) According to the written code, he shouldn't have received higher than base on them.

Weir's LP program was not CoP friendly; due to injury most of his spins were downgraded to L1's, and he had only one combination, and seven of eight jump elements. His base score was 58.7, to which he added 2 points in net GOE (60.72). He had the lowest base and lowest total technical score of any skater in the top 10 of the FS. Buttle's base, for example, was 65.00, and he made up nearly six points (for two falls) on all of his other elements, for total TCS of 63.42. Even deducting the -2.00 fall points, his technical score was higher than Weir's. And his speed, ice coverage, interpretation, and choreography in the LP performance were superior to Weir's.

I find it interesting that there's little complaint about Kevin van der Perren's scores. It amazed us that at the end of the day, he had the second highest base score (68.8, compared to TG's 72.2), and the highest actual technical score 68.71 -- higher than Lambiel's -- for a program with a 3A combo, a 3A, three 2A's, and only one L2 element. He really wracked it up with a flawed, but fully rotated, 3F+3T+3Lo combination: 13.5 points, .5 higher than a base 4T+3T.

Because of his injury, Weir was slower and more tentative in his movements -- the trunk of his body was protective and tight -- flow, and entrances to his spins. (Strangely, he didn't seem to be as tentative going into the jumps.) His arm movements weren't as full as usual, as they didn't initiate from the center of his back as they normally do, and his ice pattern was smaller than it was at Nationals, and in some spots, than in qualis. His SP, despite the fall on the 3A, had more energy than either of his two versions of Otonal.

Just as I was hoping to see a great performance of Naqoyqatsi from Buttle, I was hoping for the same from Weir with Otonal. It wasn't to be, despite every attempt on his part to excel. Despite the pain, he gave skates that many of his fellow competitors would have traded a limb for, because he is so exquisite on the ice. I think he gave championship skates because he fought through and continued knowing he couldn't be at his absolute best. There's nothing more to ask from anyone.

 

[brad640]

Weir's LP program was not CoP friendly; due to injury most of his spins were downgraded to L1's, and he had only one combination, and seven of eight jump elements. His base score was 58.7, to which he added 2 points in net GOE (60.72). He had the lowest base and lowest total technical score of any skater in the top 10 of the FS. Buttle's base, for example, was 65.00, and he made up nearly six points (for two falls) on all of his other elements, for total TCS of 63.42. Even deducting the -2.00 fall points, his technical score was higher than Weir's. And his speed, ice coverage, interpretation, and choreography in the LP performance were superior to Weir's.

hockeyfan, I enjoyed your analysis. I too was disapointed with Otonal for the reasons you noted. I was shocked when his low technical score was posted, and I did not understand what happened with the lack of combinations until after the competition. I hope Tarasova and Platov study CoP before they do choreography for the Olympic season. I know that things did not go as planned because the 3f at the end was supposed to be a combination, and the 3t at the beginning was a placeholder for the quad that never happened, but there should have been much more jump content. The thing that impressed me was the way Johnny drew on the audience at this competition, as opposed to nationals where he tried to tune the audience out.

I find it interesting that there's little complaint about Kevin van der Perren's scores. It amazed us that at the end of the day, he had the second highest base score (68.8, compared to TG's 72.2), and the highest actual technical score 68.71 -- higher than Lambiel's -- for a program with a 3A combo, a 3A, three 2A's, and only one L2 element. He really wracked it up with a flawed, but fully rotated, 3F+3T+3Lo combination: 13.5 points, .5 higher than a base 4T+3T.

VDP came in under the radar. I felt like his scores were fair, but the judges could have taken a choreography deduction for the 3 2as

 

[curious]

ITA. Even if Li does not have the high level spins or footwork, he should get credit for jumps that he does well. When a skater with 2 falls comes out ahead, the pendulum has swung too far in the other direction. I absolutely loved Buttle's SP but I can't say that about the LP (with mistakes). Johnny Weir actually skated very well, except for the fall on the 3A in the SP. He should have been on the podium.

Plushenko skated a good SP, except for that fall on the quad. It looked like he could not do the quad because of the groin injury, so it made sense for him to withdraw. Even with the fall, his SP was skated with conviction, and other jumps were OK (axel and lutz). His withdrawal gave others the taste of the kind of pressure he has been handling over the years. Most of them fell apart. Lambiel won the competition on the basis of his QR and SP- that is when Plushenko was in the competition. His LP included two singled triples, and finishing 10 seconds behind the music. Those are not minor mistakes. Joubert fell apart like no one else.He was considered the closest rival to Plushenko, and he must have felt the pressure the most when Plushenko pulled out. I hope he can heal and show everyone again what a great skater he is. His presence alone will make many others skate 100% better.

Vash

well plushy does not have to prove he is the best he does it every year unlike others.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Vash - I don't think Evgeni is surprised at Stephane's win. He has said that only Stephane and Brian take risks and they are his biggest competitions.

Let's see what happens if both Evgeni and Stephane skate flawless routines. As much as I like Johnny, I do not think he is up to their level ....YET.

Joe